The "club standard" CDJ. Lack of respect for controllerists. Why?
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The "club standard" CDJ. Lack of respect for controllerists. Why? Posted on: 05.03.2013 by Toya Spor I recently talked to a really skilled / established DJ and producer. I asked him what gear
he uses, and he said CDJs. When I told him I used a controller, he laughed then apologized, saying the standard was CDJs or Technics in the clubs/gigs he played at, and that barely anyone ever uses a controller, because no one takes them seriously. He agreed that controllers were good for an introduction to DJing though.Why do CDJs command more respect? Is it because of the lack of sync? (which isnt the case anymore because new CDJs have it, rekordbox, etc..) Are established DJs expected to "pay their way" by buying full CDJ/DJM setups before they're given respect / gigs, even if they can produce the same quality sound with a controller? Do controllers give off some sort of "toy" aura? To me, some of them do, but they are only intended for an introduction anyway. A controller like a Kontrol S4 seems to me like professional gear . I've heard mixes produced on S4s that sound better than guys with CDJ/DJM/Technics/pimp-ass setups. In the end, I believe respect should be given to people who make good sounding music. But I feel like there is this "pay your way" mentality from established DJs who don't want guys with controllers to show them up if their music is better. But I don't have the experience to know for sure. Why aren't controllerists given the same respect as a CDJ/technics user? | |
| Kristofer Krauel 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by loverocket
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| Alphonso Deitchman 06.03.2013 | They are easier for the DJs as well as the clubs. If you don't want to burn discs you can use HID/DVS and bring your laptop into the booth. HID gives you all the benefits of a computer without the hassle of bringing a whole setup with you. |
| Jerica Salava 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by makar1
That must mean that Windows is better. Huh? CDJ's are the standard because it's the easiest solution for the club. Personally, The CDJ club setup sucks for me. I have two options. #1 Bring a USB drive or #2 Burn CDR's. I like to bring 100+ tracks to a gig and feel the crowd. Option #1 I have to deal with browsing 100+ tracks on a horrible tiny LCD screen. Option #2 is like going back to 1995. Burning a folder of CD's ? That's "ahead of the scene" > |
| Alphonso Deitchman 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by mdcdesign
Toys like the Ergo and Typhoon can hardly be called "ahead of the scene". |
| Teresia Janusch 06.03.2013 | dead horse aside...i agree that cdjs, turntables etc have been the standard since the dawn of djing in some shape or form. I come from learning with vinyl 14 years ago, moving to cdjs, then to DVS...i still prefer the modular setup because its what i know the best, it also helps redundancy should anything go wrong. I do however, have a completely irrational lack of respect for young djs who use the all in one type of controllers...i know i cant justify it, but its there...and i apologise for it lol |
| Jerica Salava 06.03.2013 | Remember when we cared more about what was coming out of the speakers? Now all I hear is "what software? What gear? blah blah." Meanwhile Pauly D is headlining at WMC 2013 : http://wmc.wantickets.com/Artists/993/DJ-PAULY-D/ Wake up people. > |
| Jerica Salava 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by pbcrazy9898
> |
| Birgit Panell 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by Timbo21
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| Valene Guasp 06.03.2013 | I'm in Newcastle and its extremely rare to see a DJ using a controller, 90 percent of the decent venues have some form of cdj, always at least 800s. I wouldn't class venues having no cdjs as ahead of the scene either lol I'd class it as tight owners, quite silly to be honest. The downfall of an all in one controller for me is the all in one bit, one spilt drink equals no gear ! |
| Qiana Castellucci 06.03.2013 | Depends on if you believe controllerism, or use of controllers is ahead or not Personally I believe controllers are a good addition to the DJ booth, but not a replacement for CDJ's. i.e. for ableton etc. |
| Doreen Schurle 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by iambiggles
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| Yevette Matatall 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by Timbo21
youve never layed hand to one, so how can you say at a pinch, a pinch away. |
| Qiana Castellucci 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by mdcdesign
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| Yevette Matatall 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by mdcdesign
Cdj's are just nice to play on fullstop.... (imo) Controllers to me are just a pain in the arse to set up, soundcard, laptop, pulling cables whilst the other dj is playing. Something that TEED said in that latest interview about "the element of danger" I like this, plus I find there is something therapeutic with beat matching, I dont know, i feel the track better hearing it at its produced speed than pitching up and down and the small progression between. The only time I feel annoyed at a dj using traktor or any other software that has sync functionality is when im not hearing something special, when its not dynamic... Im not talking about beatmashing and juggling and all that jarg, I jsut feel that if you have that tool and you've gone to the trouble of setting up your gear, you could bring a little something, something for the haters to go "hey that was cool, really difficult to get that out of a cdj" my suggestion, even if you dont want to try cdj's, at least mix externally.... mixing internally is rubbish by comparison. The main club I play has had cdj nexus for 4 moths now, I havnt seen one dj take advantage of sync function, I have a few ideas that I want to try that I need it for but ill wait till i HAVE MY OWN AT HOME SO THAT WHEN IM THE FIRST GUY TO HIT THAT SYNC BUTTON my fellow dj's will be impressed enough not to snob it and realise its potential....... Heres an idea that i want to use useing sync function with Nexus. Still yet play it out, I quickly recorded it in traktor so its rough, but you get the idea. https://soundcloud.com/djnarrah/frea...-mini-mini-mix |
| Doreen Schurle 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by kooper1980
Even the DJs in the club that provides CDJs use a pair of 1000s, but do most of their actual work using an X1; that venue usually has 3-4 DJs per evening , and not all of them use the CDJs. One particularly well-known act there use an S2. |
| Kristofer Krauel 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by mdcdesign
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| Doreen Schurle 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by octostout
I guess this is a US vs Europe thing; over here in the UK, you'll be hard pressed to find a DJ using CDJs - most people use Traktor or Serato, and almost always with controllers. |
| Edwardo Rothenberger 06.03.2013 | Can someone tell me if the older standard CDJ1000's gave a bpm display? I believe if they did, then that is just a pinch away from having sync. |
| Kathe Stump 06.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by brocklambert
This exactly. Also, the S4 is a toy. I've been using controllers since all we had was the old Hercules'... And even I will say that every single All-in-one controller ever built is, and should be seen as, a toy. Compare them to the mixers and CDJs made by the same companies... they are cheap plastic toys. Except MAYBE the DDJ-SX. As someone who VERY recently switched away from an S4, after playing hundreds of gigs with it, I must say that All-in-one controllers should never, and probably WILL never be taken seriously. There's no reason to use inferior gear to do the job that the gear already on stage can do way better. Almost every real gig has Pioneer CDJs and a Pio mixer. The majority have 2000's and a DJM 900, meaning you COULD show up and control two traktor decks with nothing but a laptop and three USB cables. Bring supplemental modular controllers if you need things like cue points, effects controls, etc. This (or timecode) is what every serious Traktor DJ should be doing. |
| Gaynell Rydberg 05.03.2013 | I don't really find external mixing to be any different than internal mixing. If anything, I like it more. Not sure why, just do. |
| Doreen Schurle 05.03.2013 | Tbh, I say everyone should just follow my lead and refuse to play on CDJs full stop. If everyone did that, controllers would VERY quickly become the industry standard. Saying that, if I walked into a venue and they had an S4 already set up, I'd very quickly start regretting my decision. |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 05.03.2013 | I'm having a massive wave of D |
| Harley Zitka 05.03.2013 | If you're just starting out, or playing as an opening DJ... then you need to learn to play on whatever gear might be present on any given evening . If you can only Dj on a controller, then you won't get booked in many legitimate clubs. The last thing a club owner wants is to have $5k worth of gear in his booth and his opening DJ roll in with a $200 controller and start unplugging and repositioning the booth, making it more of a hassle for those to follow. Doesn't make sense and it looks like a crutch. It's mostly image, but it reflects on your ability (or lack thereof). My advice: learn to play on CDJ's, but advance your skills on whatever you choose. |
| Valene Guasp 05.03.2013 | What the dancefloors doing is what counts! |
| Merideth Garnder 05.03.2013 | I've dealt with this when we were touring in Asia. The snobbery in other countries is even worse.....and it was enough for me to sell our Kontrol S4 and then switch to the standard at that time - CDJ1000 Mk3s with DJM800. Fast forward to today.... I now incorporate Ableton, Maschine, and other elements along with CDJs. And I currently hold residencies at Avalon Hollywood, Exchange LA, and The Yost Theater.....some of the top venues here in Southern California. I've seen the "veterans" play on vinyl and CDs but these days it's the new generation of DJs that impress me and I've been seeing get booked more headlining evening s. The new guys come up with new music with new styles. So let him laugh all he wants. Then you can jump on your controllers like Bass Kleph and just show him what's up! |
| Fannie Ohayre 05.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by protocol
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| Trula Willadsen 05.03.2013 | There are several reasons why CDJ's are more popular I guess. If you're a club owner/promotor and you have multiple dj's working on a evening
you don't want the hassle of plugging in different kinds of controllers. There's always the risk something doesn't work the way it should immediately. Furthermore if a club has some bigger name DJ's once in a while, they will want to play on the industry standard as they often don't want to, or can't bring their own gear
. CDJ's are the branch standard. The reason why CDJ's won't be taken over by controllers in big club settings is simply the fact that if you can play music on a CDJ800, you can also play on a CDJ2000 or 400 and pretty much every other dj-cd player. And if you know how to use a basic mixer, you can easily use any DJM mixer, yet the same can't be said for controllers. You can't simply say; I've mastered the Mixtrack so now I can use anything, because software differs so much. The reason why so many industries try to standardize stuff is because it will make it easier for so many to use it. The reason why controllers are here are because they offer a lower level entry for bedroom dj's and they expand the business for all competitors. Everyone wants to survive and make a profit at the end of the day... And to be honest, compare it with driving stick vs automatic; if you're driving a car, you want to shift gears manually, even though automatic gearboxes can do it much better/efficient/faster than we can, because shifting gears is such a big part of the pleasure of driving a car, right? Same goes with beatmatching. If you take it away, you take away so much of the fun I guess. Just my 2cts |
| Delfina Suedmeyer 05.03.2013 | just like turntablist laughed at cdjs in the past, controllerists will soon laugh at cdjs. in the future, i see controllers taking over due to the fact that they are compact and easier to carry around/set up. most controllers can already do what cdjs do. it won't be long until you find one that has twice as much effects/knobs as the mixer and capabilities as a cdj player. |
| Maude Milesky 05.03.2013 | I just purchased CDJ's coming from a a VCI-100 and its definitely more of a challenge. I can't say anything about a club standard cuz I don't really get very many gigs but its not just beatmatching that was hard for me. Theres something more challenging about mixing Externally vs. Internally too. IDK Hes prolly just mad cuz he spent $3000+ on his set up and he's being outperformed by a kid with a few midi fighters and a laptop. I can see both sides of the story. |
| Lillia Datson 05.03.2013 | *****sets kindling over corpse of horse, strike's match and light's and watches as flames crackle***** Give it 5 years, and they wont be laughing. |
| Tesha Freudenstein 05.03.2013 |
Originally Posted by VanGogo
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| Charline Dye 05.03.2013 | <------steps over the equine corpse |
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