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The "club standard" CDJ. Lack of respect for controllerists. Why?

Home :: General Discussion :: The "club standard" CDJ. Lack of respect for controllerists. Why?Reply

The "club standard" CDJ. Lack of respect for controllerists. Why? Posted on: 05.03.2013 by Toya Spor I recently talked to a really skilled / established DJ and producer. I asked him what gear he uses, and he said CDJs. When I told him I used a controller, he laughed then apologized, saying the standard was CDJs or Technics in the clubs/gigs he played at, and that barely anyone ever uses a controller, because no one takes them seriously. He agreed that controllers were good for an introduction to DJing though. Why do CDJs command more respect? Is it because of the lack of sync? (which isnt the case anymore because new CDJs have it, rekordbox, etc..) Are established DJs expected to "pay their way" by buying full CDJ/DJM setups before they're given respect / gigs, even if they can produce the same quality sound with a controller? Do controllers give off some sort of "toy" aura? To me, some of them do, but they are only intended for an introduction anyway. A controller like a Kontrol S4 seems to me like professional gear . I've heard mixes produced on S4s that sound better than guys with CDJ/DJM/Technics/pimp-ass setups. In the end, I believe respect should be given to people who make good sounding music. But I feel like there is this "pay your way" mentality from established DJs who don't want guys with controllers to show them up if their music is better. But I don't have the experience to know for sure. Why aren't controllerists given the same respect as a CDJ/technics user?
Jeffrey Akinsanya 15.03.2013	Originally Posted by mdcdesign Over a thousand. And nothing, she'll just flat-out leave you for being so stupid :P wow mdcdesign! alot of this thread is due to you.. you rubbed alot of people up the wrong way earlier in the thread and i cant believe your still going lol
Salvatore Husley 15.03.2013	Originally Posted by D-Kem Good lord I can't believe this post has 27 pages dedicated to it. Who gives a monkeys about respect and kudos? Play, enjoy and express yourself. The rest is an irrelevance. Sorry man but I believe that this is a relevant discussion. Too many people believe they can play out because they have X software package and Y controller when their mixing skills are not developed enough yet. Forget "expressing" yourself when you can't do your job right. As technology improves and allows one to sync, multi-chain effects, or whatever else does not mean you should not be able to DJ out sooner. As bassline b said you should be bringing it to another level if you are using those tools. And that's why Richie Hawtin is still getting booked even if he is on a controller. If you sound shitty and you are using a controller you are only encouraging the stereotype.
Lauretta Ehrhorn 15.03.2013	Good lord I can't believe this post has 27 pages dedicated to it. Who gives a monkeys about respect and kudos? Play, enjoy and express yourself. The rest is an irrelevance.
Judi Sissel 15.03.2013	Respect is earned, Not given. Spend the money to get what you want (or believe you need) to make your own personal style and sound, get over it and enjoy it. At least stop being so butt-hurt about what Joe Schmoe believes about you, you panzis
Julissa Serrone 15.03.2013	This went from Controllers vs. CDJ's......CDJ's won that argument And now TT's or CDJ's!! This is great. I enjoy playing 1200's more than any other gear. If you can plan on TT's you can play on anything. Having said that, there is still something pretty neat about playing on a shiny pair for CDJ2000's even 900's. I do agree with Makar1, practice what you plan on playing on. And if you gig quite a bit or plan too making the investment on a good pair of CDJ's would be a good idea. Those refurb CDJ 900's look like a great deal.
Alphonso Deitchman 15.03.2013	And the Numark NDX 900s are even cheaper than the Stanton ST 150s! Learn for the media you'll be playing on is my advice.
Fannie Ohayre 15.03.2013	Originally Posted by octostout Guys, you don't need to buy CDJs, especially if you're using traktor anyways. For your home setup, just buy a pair of technics 1200's on craigslist for $500. Once you learn to use those with traktor, you can use any gear any event has. If they have TTs, great, you're already comfortable. If they have CDJ2000's use them in HID mode, it's great. If they have other CDJs, you already know how to use timecode because of your home setup, so just do it with CDJs. Owning your own CDJs is a total waste if you use Traktor. TTs are more awesome, and waaay cheaper. All the Techs I've seen on (my local) Craigslist have been beat to hell. Anyway, I don't scratch, and time code, strikes me as geared (at least from the ads) toward turntablists. However, a new pair of Stantons ST-150s will set me back for about as much as one CDJ-850. So TTs it is.
Alphonso Deitchman 15.03.2013	I don't see the logic in getting them unless you enjoy playing on them though
Hipolito Scionti 15.03.2013	Originally Posted by makar1 Unless you really want a set of turntables because you enjoy playing on them I don't see the point of owning a pair. If you want to learn to beat match it's easier to go from TTs to CDJs... TTs are cheaper... I see the logic
Alphonso Deitchman 15.03.2013	Originally Posted by LoopCat ^ Speaks the truth Unless you really want a set of CDJ's because you enjoy playing on them I don't see the point of owning a pair. Unless you really want a set of turntables because you enjoy playing on them I don't see the point of owning a pair.
Ming Devis 15.03.2013	Originally Posted by octostout Guys, you don't need to buy CDJs, especially if you're using traktor anyways. For your home setup, just buy a pair of technics 1200's on craigslist for $500. Once you learn to use those with traktor, you can use any gear any event has. If they have TTs, great, you're already comfortable. If they have CDJ2000's use them in HID mode, it's great. If they have other CDJs, you already know how to use timecode because of your home setup, so just do it with CDJs. Owning your own CDJs is a total waste if you use Traktor. TTs are more awesome, and waaay cheaper. ^ Speaks the truth Unless you really want a set of CDJ's because you enjoy playing on them I don't see the point of owning a pair.
Kathe Stump 15.03.2013	Guys, you don't need to buy CDJs, especially if you're using traktor anyways. For your home setup, just buy a pair of technics 1200's on craigslist for $500. Once you learn to use those with traktor, you can use any gear any event has. If they have TTs, great, you're already comfortable. If they have CDJ2000's use them in HID mode, it's great. If they have other CDJs, you already know how to use timecode because of your home setup, so just do it with CDJs. Owning your own CDJs is a total waste if you use Traktor. TTs are more awesome, and waaay cheaper.
Fannie Ohayre 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by makar1 You're in the US right? Keep an eye on the Pioneer refurb shop for some nice deals. There isn't a huge amount in stock right now, but the 900s are a decent player, and give you full Advanced HID control with Traktor. http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...00+Refurbished If you just want timecode rather than going for HID, the 800 Mk2s are under $1k for a pair. Thanks!
Alphonso Deitchman 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by dj subculture Actually, i have been believeing about switching back to decks for some time now. And some members here have made some convicing arguments. My two biggest concerns are, how much will I have to shell out? (Once I've figured out which Pioneer deck to use) And how much will I have to spend on the wife inorder to pacify her? (Kennoth Cole, here I come) You're in the US right? Keep an eye on the Pioneer refurb shop for some nice deals. There isn't a huge amount in stock right now, but the 900s are a decent player, and give you full Advanced HID control with Traktor. http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...00+Refurbished If you just want timecode rather than going for HID, the 800 Mk2s are under $1k for a pair.
Fannie Ohayre 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by mdcdesign Over a thousand. Figures. I still kick myself for selling my cousin my 1200s back in the day. Originally Posted by mdcdesign And nothing, she'll just flat-out leave you for being so stupid :P I'll miss her. (just kidding honey!)
Doreen Schurle 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by dj subculture Actually, i have been believeing about switching back to decks for some time now. And some members here have made some convicing arguments. My two biggest concerns are, how much will I have to shell out? (Once I've figured out which Pioneer deck to use) And how much will I have to spend on the wife inorder to pacify her? (Kennoth Cole, here I come) Over a thousand. And nothing, she'll just flat-out leave you for being so stupid :P
Fannie Ohayre 14.03.2013	Actually, i have been believeing about switching back to decks for some time now. And some members here have made some convicing arguments. My two biggest concerns are, how much will I have to shell out? (Once I've figured out which Pioneer deck to use) And how much will I have to spend on the wife inorder to pacify her? (Kennoth Cole, here I come)
Doreen Schurle 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by dj subculture After reading this entire thread, the moral of the story is, real DJs use decks. I guess its time to sell my VCI-400 and get a pair of Pioneer CDJs. Still sticking with Traktor. I can only assume that's sarcasm lol.
Fannie Ohayre 14.03.2013	After reading this entire thread, the moral of the story is, real DJs use decks. I guess its time to sell my VCI-400 and get a pair of Pioneer CDJs. Still sticking with Traktor.
Ethel Feigum 14.03.2013	Build quality is hardly worth talking about. I would hope my controller has more solid construction than a cdj, because I stuff it in a backpack and toss it into the backseat of my car, whereas my cdjs stay safely locked up in a flightcase that's too heavy to throw around. What matters more is component quality, and in most cases, the buttons, faders and knobs on traditional gear is higher quality (or at least more easily repairable/replaceable) than on a controller.
Marjorie Fallucca 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by Shishdisma I always start laughing whenever people point out the "awful build quality" of CDJ's, due to their casings. If you don't have your gear in a case or in some kind of permanent install, you're deserve whatever damage you incur, and thats just a fact. A metal casing does you absolutely nothing, except on a mixer when you have knuckles rubbing across the plate a billion times a evening . Saying a plastic casing is "horrible build quality" is really amusing because a metal casing still won't save your gear from a drop, a flight case will. With a flight case, a metal casing is just a liability, adding a lot of weight to your setup for absolutely no reason. As for CDJ's being "flimsy," effing lol. The CDJ-1000 Mk2, probably one of the most prolific decks I've seen out there (with the Mk3's being a close second), were discontinued something like 8 years ago this year. But they're still going strong, albeit with minor repairs to seriously abused controls. I've never seen a Native Instruments controller last more than a year overall, and I would love to see how you would go about cost-efficiently repairing some of the wanton usage wear I've seen on them. I have two CDJ-500's (discontinued in 1996) that both still work. They have been kept in flight case for their entire life. They have had some years in storage and a few services in their lifetime. I am still using the same DJM-500 that I have been using for the past 17 years. I am about to upgrade it to a Z2. It still works fine I just want an update is all.
Lenita Verhoeff 14.03.2013	Again the same points, the same argue, the same X vs Y... From my point of view and being a person in charge of a Digital Djing website, i believe the real question here is not one being better then another. If fact, the topic asks the oppinion about CDJ's being a Standard Gear on booths being or not lack of respect for DJ's. Well... as the clubs must attend the majority of professionals i would say: No....it's not a lack of respect! The lack of respect is not to have any addicional space in the booth if there is a controller based DJ to play. People, in the end it's all about proffit for the club, for the managers and for the DJ...no matter what you play on. The question about being or not respected among other Dj's for playing in Controllers and vice-versa is nothing. If you can't have a good tunes sellection, good technic, good reading of the dance floor and the abillity to keep the crowd dancing and buying drinks, then you're done. There are massive huge professionals in both worlds that don't get booked, so what's the point of argue? As an example: Many of you guys said the controller user are just "kids" and that they have no respect for the "old school" pro's, i believe there is an example even some may find a joke... but tell me, among the music artists who respects "Justin Biever" as a performer?? Almost no one... but in fact that "kid" has every gig a full house, gives the crowd what they want and get commercial big dollar bills! So, i don't really care about being a perfect Dj's among others concept, in the end it
Danae Dumler 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by Shishdisma I always start laughing whenever people point out the "awful build quality" of CDJ's, due to their casings. If you don't have your gear in a case or in some kind of permanent install, you're deserve whatever damage you incur, and thats just a fact. A metal casing does you absolutely nothing, except on a mixer when you have knuckles rubbing across the plate a billion times a evening . Saying a plastic casing is "horrible build quality" is really amusing because a metal casing still won't save your gear from a drop, a flight case will. With a flight case, a metal casing is just a liability, adding a lot of weight to your setup for absolutely no reason. As for CDJ's being "flimsy," effing lol. The CDJ-1000 Mk2, probably one of the most prolific decks I've seen out there (with the Mk3's being a close second), were discontinued something like 8 years ago this year. But they're still going strong, albeit with minor repairs to seriously abused controls. I've never seen a Native Instruments controller last more than a year overall, and I would love to see how you would go about cost-efficiently repairing some of the wanton usage wear I've seen on them. I said they're flimsy compared to 1200s, not compared to S4s. That's just a fact. I also said they're great machines - my CDJ-1000 mk1 still works, and it was a guitar center floor model when I bought it so it's seen its fair share of abuse. My problem with them is twofold - they feel like toys, even if they're not, and secondly, they are laughably overpriced. For $500, ok, the CDJ-2000 makes sense; maybe even for $800 street price and $1000 MSRP. But $2500???? Come on. I can get a pair of mint condition M5Gs for just over half that price and that's after the ridiculous "discontinued" markup. What makes them so expensive? The high quality laser? You can get a consumer grade CD player brand new for $50. You can get a CD-ROM drive for $10. I believe CDJs are perfectly acceptable machines for what they do, but a machine that costs $2500 should not feel like a plastic toy.
Jetta Drenzek 14.03.2013	I go for 5 minutes to a whole hour, if the crowd wants it, the crowd can have it, I'm paid to play for them and I give them what they want. Arguing who respects who is moot, because most DJs don't respect other DJs regardless of what they use. DJs by far and large are, and have always been, philandering good for nothing assholes. In fact an old DJ I used to work with (he was in his 50's, DJed all over the world) told me the only reason DJ's want women is to carry their vinyl crates back to the car haha.
Jonathan Chiuchiolo 14.03.2013	hip hop is different... With dance music you need to create a dancing environment and put the listeners into a trance, hip hop is about the crowd having fun and bobbing their head while drinking... I'll bet you do that routine for 10 - 15 minutes or so before playing songs. It's always about song selection for the crowd not other dj's, this thread is about respect from other dj's. almost all of the crowd don't care what you are doing as long as they hear their favorite songs and there are people to dance with, half of them probably can't even tell a good mix from a galloping mess.
Jetta Drenzek 14.03.2013	My F1 hip hop mash up of roughly 1 new track every 128 beats goes down a storm. It's not the skill or the gear, it the song selection. It is always the song selection.
Tiara Bastarache 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by synthet1c FFS this thread is lame... The medium that the tracks are played through doesn't matter. The mixer does and no controller has a good enough mixer section 'soundwise' to compete with xone's or djm's, which are always set up in any decent booth. the main reason kids with controllers get no respect is because they couldn't dj without a controller and software! argue about it anyway you like but it is still not going to earn you any respect. Learn to mix without waves and sync and you won't get any shit. Beatmatching will also mean that you are never bored enough to rape the effects and probably can't play 4 tracks at a time at a rate of 1 new track every 128 beats which sounds atrocious. It is also much more fun when you have to work to keep the mix going. Ding ding ding! Ladies and Gents we have a winner!
Jonathan Chiuchiolo 14.03.2013	FFS this thread is lame... The medium that the tracks are played through doesn't matter. The mixer does and no controller has a good enough mixer section 'soundwise' to compete with xone's or djm's, which are always set up in any decent booth. the main reason kids with controllers get no respect is because they couldn't dj without a controller and software! argue about it anyway you like but it is still not going to earn you any respect. Learn to mix without waves and sync and you won't get any shit. Beatmatching will also mean that you are never bored enough to rape the effects and probably can't play 4 tracks at a time at a rate of 1 new track every 128 beats which sounds atrocious. It is also much more fun when you have to work to keep the mix going.
Lillia Datson 15.03.2013	Just found a couple of pictures from Cable in London, showing an S4 in use, alongside CDJ's and TT's. Cable is a pretty big club in london, so this is refreshing to see a controller in the booth. http://www.cable-london.com/broadcas...y-photos-cable
Kathe Stump 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by Bassline Brine It's also one of those things that the cost gets shifted from the venues and promoters, and onto the DJ to provide the mixing gear . And I just don't see that happening on the broader scale, for a very long time if ever. Showing up and knowing you are going to be able to use a top end mixer and decent turntables or CDJ's? It's more that needed. What happens to anyone who DOESN'T use a controller? Do they just stop getting booked? Are people all of a sudden all going to stop using CDJs when /most/ clubs and promoters provide them? It's just realism. Controllers have a niche as an effective way to get into the game at a cost efficient parameter. They are also great for mobile DJing. Once you move into club environments, other things do it better and more efficiently. That being said, I'm not against people using controllers in any way. But it's a starter way to get into things before you move onward and upward, or you better damned well be pushing the boundaries of technology and doing things that a traditional setup cannot. This is more or less perfect. controllers are EITHER for newbies, OR can be used to do next-level shit. Problem is that every DJ on the planet believes they're doing next-level shit any time they're doing anything but transitioning. On this community , and in real life, 90% of these people are kids sounding like shit, spamming effects and cue points, believeing they're being "expressive", and that anyone not doing that is just a boring traditional DJ. Hopefully people will realize that "controllerism" sucks 90% of the time. Thankfully, few of these kids get booked. Where I live, I'm among the maybe 15% of the DJs actually get booked for gigs that matter, who use controllers. Also, I believe pretty much all of us are using them in addition to the standard gear. Also, hi Colin.
Nancey Inderlied 14.03.2013	I always start laughing whenever people point out the "awful build quality" of CDJ's, due to their casings. If you don't have your gear in a case or in some kind of permanent install, you're deserve whatever damage you incur, and thats just a fact. A metal casing does you absolutely nothing, except on a mixer when you have knuckles rubbing across the plate a billion times a evening . Saying a plastic casing is "horrible build quality" is really amusing because a metal casing still won't save your gear from a drop, a flight case will. With a flight case, a metal casing is just a liability, adding a lot of weight to your setup for absolutely no reason. As for CDJ's being "flimsy," effing lol. The CDJ-1000 Mk2, probably one of the most prolific decks I've seen out there (with the Mk3's being a close second), were discontinued something like 8 years ago this year. But they're still going strong, albeit with minor repairs to seriously abused controls. I've never seen a Native Instruments controller last more than a year overall, and I would love to see how you would go about cost-efficiently repairing some of the wanton usage wear I've seen on them.
Lashawn Maycock 14.03.2013	Slightly aside of the main thrust of discussion here, but it always amuses me regarding the general perception of a direct correlation between materials and build quality i.e. metal construction = good, plastics = bad. It's a silly one in my opinion, it's not the material itself, it's how it is implemented in the design. Regarding accomdating the 3 major methods of DJing i.e. turntables, CDJ's and controllers - assuming there is sufficient booth space and it has been designed with that in mind, it shouldn't really be an issue to have a standard setup of turntables and CDJ's and dedicated space to set up a controller/laptop configuration. One of the festivals I played at last year used the following and it worked without a problem or drop out of music - 2x S4's, CDJs, Tech 1210s and an Ableton Live setup - all setup on the day, no problems at all, mind you it does help that all of the DJ's understood the concept of audio routing and running a sound rig, something which not every DJ seems to possess IMHO.
Latina Samon 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by mdcdesign In 5 years time, you could walk into any booth in a high end club, plug your laptop in and be ready to go. THIS I would be satisfied with. You basically can already?? Nothing will replace CDJs in my opinion. Already said why. The 'CD' function may be lost but a midi controller isn't going to take the place of them. There's always going to be different mixers that big DJs/clubs want to use as well as whatever the standard decks are at the time.
Qiana Castellucci 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by mdcdesign Well ellaskins seemed pretty impressed with them, which is good enough for me tbh! I need to see if I can get hold of a pair at some point to see for myself, ideally without having to pay for them as I'm currently skint lol. Hold on a sec, you're advocating a particular CDJ yet you've never even used one? Jesus fucking christ man, have you no shame? Don't you EVER learn?
Danae Dumler 14.03.2013	Originally Posted by mdcdesign In 5 years time, you could walk into any booth in a high end club, plug your laptop in and be ready to go. You can do that today, pretty much with or without a laptop. I don't like CDJs much either - they've always felt flimsy to me compared to 1200s; I own the first model CDJ-1000 (just one; it does the trick when I need it but mostly sits in a box) and like everyone else I drooled when the 2000 came out but when I actually played with a set I stopped drooling; ever since then I've been in stunned disbelief that they wanted $2500 apiece for those things. They are great machines and as I said they do the trick but man it feels even flimsier than my 1000 mk1. That's a feature not a bug I suppose; they're probably lighter and easier to transport and obviously have many more features, but for me it just doesn't seem all that fun to play with. Nevertheless, they are the standard today at any high end club just about anywhere, and they do exactly what you're asking for, laptop or no. The most you'd have to add to that setup is a soundcard, but I'd bet a lot of the high end clubs have those too, or mixers with them built in. The problem, I believe, is you're expecting clubs to be set up for heavy mashup and cue point juggle artists -- I just don't see that as more than a niche market.
Georgie Lukowiak 13.03.2013	But then again , you show up too any party with CDJ's and you look like a mega pimp
Audrey Pinda 13.03.2013	Originally Posted by mdcdesign I believe the main issue that this thread has highlighted is that there's a significant number of DJs out there who just simply don't feel that Pioneer CDJs _ARE_ professional pieces of gear; not anymore, at least. 5 years ago, I would've been ecstatic to walk into a club and see a set of CDJs all ready to go, but these days DJing has moved on past the level of A-->B mixing with some poorly executed flangers on a DJM mixer. They're a LEGACY industry standard, not a current one. The problem is, there's no ONE standard to replace them yet. Nobody's come up with a widely accepted, standardised MIDI controller replacement for CDJs... NI are close with the Z2 and a pair of X1s, but no jogs is a dealbreaker for most. If Native Instruments came out with a combined transport/FX controller (like the Reloop Contour) but equipped with 8" jogwheels like CDJs, they'd have a REAL shot at becoming the new industry standard. In 5 years time, you could walk into any booth in a high end club, plug your laptop in and be ready to go. THIS I would be satisfied with. The biggest problem I see with this is a complete shift some things: Having every DJ basically bring their own mixing gear . This would not work on the long term I feel, though it is viable to a degree, because of the minimal amount of crap you actually have to bring if you spin on CDJ's. Two thumb drives? A CD Wallet? Check. Convincing me that is not the most practical way to go about spinning is going to be difficult. With any controller, or even vinyl setup, it's just a lot more crap to deal with as a DJ to bring to a club. That being said, I spin on Serato and just show up with my laptop, stand, headphones, audio interface, and control vinyl/cdjs. I probably could bring a controller... but it's also nice knowing that I'm showing up using professional gear, and not having to worry about the gear itself. I plan on making the switch to CDJ's and spending time learning them, but it IS a financial cost learning that method. But it's one of those things like riding a bike, once you learn it, you know it, and then are able to practice on other mediums. It's also one of those things that the cost gets shifted from the venues and promoters, and onto the DJ to provide the mixing gear . And I just don't see that happening on the broader scale, for a very long time if ever. Showing up and knowing you are going to be able to use a top end mixer and decent turntables or CDJ's? It's more that needed. What happens to anyone who DOESN'T use a controller? Do they just stop getting booked? Are people all of a sudden all going to stop using CDJs when /most/ clubs and promoters provide them? It's just realism. Controllers have a niche as an effective way to get into the game at a cost efficient parameter. They are also great for mobile DJing. Once you move into club environments, other things do it better and more efficiently. That being said, I'm not against people using controllers in any way. But it's a starter way to get into things before you move onward and upward, or you better damned well be pushing the boundaries of technology and doing things that a traditional setup cannot.
Alphonso Deitchman 13.03.2013	Originally Posted by mdcdesign I believe the main issue that this thread has highlighted is that there's a significant number of DJs out there who just simply don't feel that Pioneer CDJs _ARE_ professional pieces of gear Sure they are. They might not include every feature you'd like but theyre definitely professional. Why else would every major music festival and big club have them on stage? Originally Posted by mdcdesign The problem is, there's no ONE standard to replace them yet. Nobody's come up with a widely accepted, standardised MIDI controller replacement for CDJs... NI are close with the Z2 and a pair of X1s, but no jogs is a dealbreaker for most. If Native Instruments came out with a combined transport/FX controller (like the Reloop Contour) but equipped with 8" jogwheels like CDJs, they'd have a REAL shot at becoming the new industry standard. In 5 years time, you could walk into any booth in a high end club, plug your laptop in and be ready to go. THIS I would be satisfied with. Pioneer have done this already. Plug 2 USB cables from your computer to the CDJs and you have full transport control. Combine with a mixer of your choice and you have a full setup. You can add in a small modular controller if you like for additional things like Traktor FX. The Z2 was a step forward but its performance outside of Traktor is very poor. Build quality was an improvement but they still need to work on it.
Doreen Schurle 13.03.2013	Originally Posted by Bassline Brine There is something to be said for having a standard for promoters to conform to as well, and have gear that you can use. Some people will do anything, for anything, and you get what you pay for in the end. If you want a good evening , go to an establishment that has good gear . It's going to BRING the better DJ's. Not because they don't like controllers, many have one at home or for small gigs/shows/house parties. But because for a professional environment, you want professional gear. I believe the main issue that this thread has highlighted is that there's a significant number of DJs out there who just simply don't feel that Pioneer CDJs _ARE_ professional pieces of gear; not anymore, at least. 5 years ago, I would've been ecstatic to walk into a club and see a set of CDJs all ready to go, but these days DJing has moved on past the level of A-->B mixing with some poorly executed flangers on a DJM mixer. They're a LEGACY industry standard, not a current one. The problem is, there's no ONE standard to replace them yet. Nobody's come up with a widely accepted, standardised MIDI controller replacement for CDJs... NI are close with the Z2 and a pair of X1s, but no jogs is a dealbreaker for most. If Native Instruments came out with a combined transport/FX controller (like the Reloop Contour) but equipped with 8" jogwheels like CDJs, they'd have a REAL shot at becoming the new industry standard. In 5 years time, you could walk into any booth in a high end club, plug your laptop in and be ready to go. THIS I would be satisfied with.
Audrey Pinda 13.03.2013	If you aren't willing to bring the gear you want if the venue / gig isn't providing it, don't take the gig. At one point I lost my Serato CD's. I slept in (it was my day off and was out the evening before) and didn't have time to get to the local Guitar Center to pick up some new ones. So I downloaded the control tone, burnt the CD's to disc... and put my turntables in the trunk of my car. Now, I prefer spinning on turntables. But with the gig, I was pretty sure that CDJ's would be provided. But I wasn't sure if my control CD's would work. So I had a back-up plan. Fast-forward a bit. The gig provided CDJ-850k's, and they worked great. Simple setup, and my burned CD's worked perfectly for what I needed them to. That being said? The next DJ who showed up was ready for turntables only. And I was able to save the day, because I had them in my car. Now some people wouldn't offer the use of their tables. Some people would have taken the extra hour to spin longer. But when you can help? Why not. Thing is, if a gig doesn't provide CDJ's or Turntables... you probably don't want that gig in my experience. If you're going to bring your own gear out, charge more. There is something to be said for having a standard for promoters to conform to as well, and have gear that you can use. Some people will do anything, for anything, and you get what you pay for in the end. If you want a good evening , go to an establishment that has good gear . It's going to BRING the better DJ's. Not because they don't like controllers, many have one at home or for small gigs/shows/house parties. But because for a professional environment, you want professional gear. It's not just promoters hating on DJ's. It's DJ's holding the scene to a higher standard in many cases as well. It's just something that should be provided for any legit gig. That being said, pissing and moaning about /what/ gear is provided is just dumb.

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The "club standard" CDJ. Lack of respect for controllerists. Why?