Traktor Scratch Poor (a.k.a. Ghetto Timecode Control)
Traktor Scratch Poor (a.k.a. Ghetto Timecode Control) Posted on: 09.04.2009 by Aurelia Lenox So after a few hours of tweaking, I have a working timecode vinyl control setup within Traktor Scratch Pro without the Audio8, or any other pricey 4in/4out card. In fact, my external soundcard only has 2 inputs! Since Traktor only allows you to use one sound device at a time, combining your available devices involves a little bit of software trickery. Here's my current setup:
Oh, and a free copy of Traktor Scratch Pro from a friend who bought it and decided he liked Serato better Total: $1360. Here's how my current setup is connected: 1) Technics Deck A: Connect barrel connectors to phono output, then use RCA-to-1/8" to connect to Macbook Pro's stereo line-in. 2) Technics Deck B: Connect barrel connectors to phono output, then use RCA-to-1/8" to connect to HarmonyAudio's stereo line-in. 3) Onto the software trickery! Open up the Audio Midi Setup app in /Applications/Utilities and create an Aggregate Audio Device. More information here: http://www.apple.com/pro/techniques/aggregateaudio/. My Aggregate Device is: Macbook Line-In (2 in, resampled) HarmonyAudio (2 in / 8 out, set as clock) You'll want to set the clock to whatever device you're outputting to, and resample all your other devices to keep them in sync. The order of your devices in the list is that order that Traktor will see the inputs/outputs on the Aggregate Device. So if my list is in the above order, then in Traktor I would see: "Aggregate Device (4 in, 8 out)" ...which would correlate as listed below, for me. Aggregate Device In 0 -- Macbook Line-In Channel 0 Aggregate Device In 1 -- Macbook Line-In Channel 1 Aggregate Device In 2 -- HarmonyAudio In Channel 0 Aggregate Device In 3 -- HarmonyAudio In Channel 1 Aggregate Device Out 0 -- HarmonyAudio Out Channel 0 Aggregate Device Out 1 -- HarmonyAudio Out Channel 1 Aggregate Device Out 2-7 -- HarmonyAudio Out Channel 2-7 You'll likely have a different soundcard, and therefore a different quantity and combination of inputs/outputs, so I'm just defining the connections to clarify my example setup. 4) Now open up Traktor Scratch Pro. Set your audio device to the Aggregate Device, map your Input Routing/Output Routing, and go to Timecode Setup. Should now be seeing a timecode signal for Decks A and B! I had to adjust my inputs until I got a strong enough signal for Traktor to read the timecode. On my HarmonyAudio box I just turned the input gain all the way up, and for the Macbook Pro line-in, I went to Sound Preferences and set it Line-In to 75% gain (just before the 4th tick). Once everything was set, I had a solid, responsive vinyl setup, with a 2.5ms latency. Right now, I'm only using two of my soundcard's outputs into my monitors. For when I use this in a club, I would just use the HarmonyAudio's 8 outputs into the club mixer. 4 for Decks A&B into the mixer, 2 for monitoring and 2 for rec/ other line out. I'll put a vid of this setup working if anybody wants it, but a lot of you should have similar enough gear to try this out for yourselves. Good luck! -- Charlie Tran, Brooklyn bedroom DJ / web developer | |
| Doug Bieling 20.04.2009 | Ok sorry about my stupidity on this one if it is stupidity but if you have 2 ins ie one stereo in or two mono ins on a soundcard, could you not plug two turntables into the inputs but use a two into one connector type thing and have one tt on each of the ins afterall its not sound its just a controll technique so why you need stereo ? PS go easy as i know nothing about traktor scratch and the way it works |
| Shane Golia 20.04.2009 | I actually tried this with my Rane SL1 interface. The SL1 is made to accept phono line - BUT, for some reason the input signal on it with my turntables connected directly to it was too low for Traktor and I was getting bad tracking. I am believeing that this is the case since I have to use the SL1 ASIO driver which has absolutely no software options to adjust the input gain. When I run the turntables through my mixer to boost the phono signal and then into the SL1 it works fine, but then that only leaves me with 2 channels to use on my DDM4000. Does anyone know how to boost the input of the SL1 using software? Does anyone know of any ASIO drivers that work with the Rane SL1 that will allow me to adjust the input gain? In the end, I just gave up, since it is fine for me to use Traktor without control vinyl, since that is what has lured me into making the switch from Scratch Live to Traktor. I am finding that Traktor Pro is much more fun than Scratch Live, since I don't have to spend any time beat matching and now have time for more effects and loop fun. And yes I have been beatmatching since 1999, but when you start adding in the 3rd and 4th deck, i'd rather be spending my time tweaking effects than nudging records and pitch controls on long 2 min+ mixes. I'm real close to selling my Scratch Live setup and just buying a Maya 44 USB card instead..... |
| Aurelia Lenox 20.04.2009 | Glad to hear this is working out for some people. Still in the middle of writing up a proper tutorial, I'm going to be using these units: http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/UFO202.aspx $65 shipped for two of them, and once you aggregate, you have a 4x4 device that has built in preamps and headphone monitoring, with the option to mix in Traktor with your VCI or use an external mixer, since you have a L/R output available for each deck. Or you could buy four of these for ~$125ish to build an 8x8, but even that's getting a little bit hacky/silly for my tastes |
| Mechelle Duncil 20.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by lethal_pizzle
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| Marshall Aby 20.04.2009 | It probably is in Native Instrument's interest to patch this a.s.a.p. Before the NI community s fill up with people asking for support with unsupported hardware. Oh the horror! |
| Mechelle Duncil 20.04.2009 | Actually you could connect the 1200s to the analog inputs also, the only issue is that the signal might be to low, but they will probably work. I only have Traktor 3.4 I don |
| Doug Bieling 20.04.2009 | So in my case i cant do it with my techncs 1210's but i could with my cdjs as i can digi out to my audiophile with one and then rca to the other. (SORRY BIG EDIT - ITS AN AUDIPHILE USB NOT A FIREWIRE SO LESS INS ) |
| Mechelle Duncil 20.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by MisterMoleyMole
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| Doug Bieling 20.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by alien2k
Also if its on a pc where is it you go and change all the settings in the software trickery bit? G |
| Mechelle Duncil 20.04.2009 | I am using vinyl timecode with Traktor 3.4, XP and a M-audio audiophile firewire. Works great. My sound card has only 2 rca inputs and 1 spdif input. I have 1 tt which has a spif out conected to the correspondant input and the other tt is conected to the rca. The second one need some boosting of the signal when using the tt phono out, but still works without boositing it. No issues so far. |
| Doug Bieling 20.04.2009 | Hey all Is this a mac only hack or is it poss to get it working on a PC ? anyone done it ? Gav |
| Aurelia Lenox 20.04.2009 | Hey dudes, sorry for the article holdup. I keep finding things to tweak in the setup for better stability/portability. In the meantime, here's the missing step to make this all work on a Mac w/ a legit copy of TSP: go to Audio Midi Setup, open up the Aggregate Device Editor, and name your device "Audio 8 DJ". Told you it was simple |
| Virginia Ortiz 15.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by Chilly
[QUOTE=Chilly;42691]I should have addressed this before my post...the Beatport article wasn't about finding a way to cheat Beatport out of money...it was to legitimately pay for your songs while going through territory restrictions.[QUOTE] ya good call. |
| Nick Ross 15.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by EanGolden
NI has a demo version which serves this purpose. Similar to Serato in terms of functionality of the software with timecode. The 'no serious harm done' can be viewed as serious harm being done. People will just buy TPro, no matter which version, and then download just 1.1.1 (or whatever). Never even attempting to download the latest version AND a Traktor certified soundcard / mixer. Just my thought. |
| Keli Vandenbergh 15.04.2009 | ... lol ... |
| Nick Ross 15.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by EanGolden
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| 15.04.2009 | I will check with NI and see what the official position on this kind of thing is but to be honest i see it this way: You need to buy Traktor Scratch Pro (so you are still buying a NI product) but instead using another sounds card to get your inputs into the computer. Eventually this person is likely to upgrade to a audio 4 or audio 8. it seems that if it enables people to test out a product and then legitimately buy the hardware if they want to use this method- so no serious harm done. |
| Nick Ross 14.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by Kaon
Originally Posted by ctran
Originally Posted by Fresh
Don't get me wrong. I believe it's interesting and all, but I'm not about condoning an exploitation in a product that I (along with others) are vested in. I believe. |
| Keli Vandenbergh 14.04.2009 | ... NI & Serato are closed solutions non innovative, only stable and "standard" but ITCH for example and "closed" protocol which it has is only midi 14 bits (pitch bend and mtc) and HID protocol dressed as "optimized link between soft and hard". Closed by handshaking like Akai APC40 and limiting the creativity for gain control of market. I must learn electronics and Pure Data for doing it myself but when I done it, I will share it freely because ITCH and Handshakes are not "Standard", the standard is MIDI, HID and (it coming) OSC. Sell knowledge in closed form is no other than Fear to Freedom of choice. I share my ideas and I saw them in many "improvements". Call me madman, I know what I'm saying. ... |
| Greg Gow 14.04.2009 | This thread was linked on the NI community shortly after it was started here, so it really does not matter where this article was/is posted, someone would have linked it to the DJTT community as well. |
| Aurelia Lenox 14.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by Chilly
2) Again, nothing that I could see for me personally, if DJTT stands to lose some substantial relationship perks with NI then any DJTT employee is welcome to tell me to stop putting time into this. 3) If this makes it possible for just one person to explore and play with timecode vinyl, and helps them reconnect with music the way that DJTT has for me, then yes it's worth it for me. ETA is this Friday for the vid/article, by the way. |
| Virginia Ortiz 14.04.2009 | yea you gotta wonder,although i would have asked the same questions about the beatport article. however the answers may have been different |
| Nick Ross 14.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by ctran
Not that anything's been mentioned yet, but if NI patches this and an article is posted, then DJTT could be seen as propagating an exploit in a company that supports them (and vice versa). Questions I'd ask myself: What are you really gaining by posting and endorsing this article? What are the consequences of posting this endorsed article? Is it worth any foreseeable trouble? Just my $.02. |
| Nick Ross 14.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by mpetersen3
Take a breath boy!! lol |
| Aurelia Lenox 14.04.2009 | It's just about the money, and you can't blame NI for trying to make a profit. Right now, they make a tidy sum by selling the Audio8/Audio4 and also selling "Traktor Scratch Certified" licenses to other mixer/soundcard manufacturers. This workaround will adversely affect that, so it's really more that they have to, not that they hate the bedroom DJ or anything. |
| Hertha Fang 14.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by ctran
Why is the first question that comes to mind? I can understand that NI wants to make money but isn't that a pretty monopolistic policy that will prevent NI's userbase from spreading, where in contrast with other restricted timecode vinyl software (really just in contrast with SSL, since Ms. Pinky and others aren't as widely used afaik) allowing the Scratch software to be unrestricted w/ regards to hardware would be more attractive for new users who could start using TSP for the cost of the software + timecode vinyl cost (assuming they already have the necessary other gear and are using another software) and wouldn't have to buy a 2nd soundcard that does extra except being recognized and allowed. Regardless of whether or not NI implements this freedom, people will likely hack the software to implement this as it saves serious cash and increases compatability. So hopefully (probably very much in vain) they will not patch this *problem* out. |
| Aurelia Lenox 14.04.2009 | Hey Karlos, Sorry if it seemed like I was specifically calling you out for "drama". I just don't like being called a straight up liar. We coo, we coo? Anyways, I do have to cede a point. Firstly, let me reiterate that I am using a fully legit, uncracked, unmodified Mac version of Traktor Scratch Pro 1.1.2 -- in my vid, I'll even download/install the demo from the NI site to prove it. Second, Karlos is correct that there is a cracked version of TSP 1.1.1 that has no hardware restrictions, which is likely the version being used in the above vid with the BCD3000. But, there is a part of my tutorial that I didn't list where I actually unintentionally bypassed NI's hardware restrictions. It's actually hilariously simple, totally legal, and will 99.99% definitely be patched out in the next version of TSP, especially once I publicize it. Karlos or anyone else, you're free to hit me up via PM or AIM and I'll let you know what it is, but I'd rather not reveal it until I write my article, since it's my first one at DJTT and I want it to have some impact. |
| Keli Vandenbergh 14.04.2009 | ... These guy says there is a bug in "cracked version" which accepts BCD3000 as a NI soundcard. I doesn't want to promote piracy but it seems there are various sources of this issue (or bug). This is the reason for my curiosity. For my DVS are outdated nowadays. ... |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 14.04.2009 | Yeah ok dude, i aint here to cause trouble, quite the contrary. Ill step back from this a little until i understand it more. Like i say i aint here for 'drama' as you put it. Oh and worth noting. That video posted above, Dont Believe The Hype. |
| Keli Vandenbergh 14.04.2009 | ... Look this guy on youtube: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Vd_mKcDF3oE&eurl ... |
| Nick Ross 13.04.2009 | Well, Karlos is a moderator on NI's community s. Not really a stranger by any stretch of the imagination. |
| Aurelia Lenox 13.04.2009 | Oy, was hoping to keep this thread drama free. I'll post the vid soon, delayed it thus far because I wanted to post it at the same time as the article for the front page. I'm not giving out reg info just to defend against accusations from a stranger, heh. I'll run through the whole process with the 1.1.2 Mac demo download to be sure. In the meantime, any else here who also has a legit copy of TSP, feel free to chip in and prove me wrong. |
| Keli Vandenbergh 13.04.2009 | ... Ok, Anybody else? I use Ms. Pinky but is pure curiosity! ... |
| Nick Ross 13.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by Karlos Santos
Originally Posted by ctran
... My point about the timecode and you being able to follow through is that he explicitly stated he had a legit version of the software. Far be it for me to call shenanigans on his comment, but you have the power to validate that claim. This is pretty serious stuff. If you are able to do this with a legit version of TPro, then it may make the purchase of a Traktor Certified soundcard/mixer obsolete. |
| Nick Ross 13.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by Karlos Santos
If 'Ctran' is truly 'laughing' (or whatever) at your first post when you mentioned this, then he could supply you with his Registration number and you can verify it, right? Secondly, I believe I might be naive with this timecode + software + hardware technology, because I can't wrap my mind around why it would make a difference if he is using a cracked copy of the software or not. Doesn't the hardware play any specific role in the timecode formula? Better question...HOW does the hardware play a role in the formula? If you can 'crack' TPro to use any soundcard input, why can't you do the same for Serato? Shit...that would be the best solution, as they provide their full software package for free, but it's useless unless you have the SL-1, SL-3, or the TTM-57SL. |
| Carina Kosmo 13.04.2009 | omg just try it, know that its not the same, but its pretty much the same... |
| Keli Vandenbergh 13.04.2009 | ...
Originally Posted by KLOSELINE
Originally Posted by KLOSELINE
... |
| Keli Vandenbergh 13.04.2009 |
Originally Posted by ctran
Isn' t? But you are trying different timecode whe we are talking about pass off the "soundcard Dongle" Maybe I missed something... ... |
| Carina Kosmo 13.04.2009 | i know that torq and mspinky are the same engine. im talking about serato traktor scratch and final scratch vinyls, just try it by yourself. the timecode is pretty much the same. this dodesnt mean tat you can ctually use it. the ptich is toally out of range, the ms pinky and torq tiemcode runs backwards, and you cant use absolute mode, but its not that the timecode is getting compeltely ignored when using it with other systems. the music plays just in a complety wrong matter but its isnt skipping or soemthing... however this thread is not about using timecode with another software, i was just wondering that nothing happened at all wehn ive tried it... |
| Nick Ross 13.04.2009 | Video? |
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