Traktor Scratch Poor (a.k.a. Ghetto Timecode Control)
Traktor Scratch Poor (a.k.a. Ghetto Timecode Control) Posted on: 09.04.2009 by Aurelia Lenox So after a few hours of tweaking, I have a working timecode vinyl control setup within Traktor Scratch Pro without the Audio8, or any other pricey 4in/4out card. In fact, my external soundcard only has 2 inputs! Since Traktor only allows you to use one sound device at a time, combining your available devices involves a little bit of software trickery. Here's my current setup:
Oh, and a free copy of Traktor Scratch Pro from a friend who bought it and decided he liked Serato better Total: $1360. Here's how my current setup is connected: 1) Technics Deck A: Connect barrel connectors to phono output, then use RCA-to-1/8" to connect to Macbook Pro's stereo line-in. 2) Technics Deck B: Connect barrel connectors to phono output, then use RCA-to-1/8" to connect to HarmonyAudio's stereo line-in. 3) Onto the software trickery! Open up the Audio Midi Setup app in /Applications/Utilities and create an Aggregate Audio Device. More information here: http://www.apple.com/pro/techniques/aggregateaudio/. My Aggregate Device is: Macbook Line-In (2 in, resampled) HarmonyAudio (2 in / 8 out, set as clock) You'll want to set the clock to whatever device you're outputting to, and resample all your other devices to keep them in sync. The order of your devices in the list is that order that Traktor will see the inputs/outputs on the Aggregate Device. So if my list is in the above order, then in Traktor I would see: "Aggregate Device (4 in, 8 out)" ...which would correlate as listed below, for me. Aggregate Device In 0 -- Macbook Line-In Channel 0 Aggregate Device In 1 -- Macbook Line-In Channel 1 Aggregate Device In 2 -- HarmonyAudio In Channel 0 Aggregate Device In 3 -- HarmonyAudio In Channel 1 Aggregate Device Out 0 -- HarmonyAudio Out Channel 0 Aggregate Device Out 1 -- HarmonyAudio Out Channel 1 Aggregate Device Out 2-7 -- HarmonyAudio Out Channel 2-7 You'll likely have a different soundcard, and therefore a different quantity and combination of inputs/outputs, so I'm just defining the connections to clarify my example setup. 4) Now open up Traktor Scratch Pro. Set your audio device to the Aggregate Device, map your Input Routing/Output Routing, and go to Timecode Setup. Should now be seeing a timecode signal for Decks A and B! I had to adjust my inputs until I got a strong enough signal for Traktor to read the timecode. On my HarmonyAudio box I just turned the input gain all the way up, and for the Macbook Pro line-in, I went to Sound Preferences and set it Line-In to 75% gain (just before the 4th tick). Once everything was set, I had a solid, responsive vinyl setup, with a 2.5ms latency. Right now, I'm only using two of my soundcard's outputs into my monitors. For when I use this in a club, I would just use the HarmonyAudio's 8 outputs into the club mixer. 4 for Decks A&B into the mixer, 2 for monitoring and 2 for rec/ other line out. I'll put a vid of this setup working if anybody wants it, but a lot of you should have similar enough gear to try this out for yourselves. Good luck! -- Charlie Tran, Brooklyn bedroom DJ / web developer | |
| Sona Nebenzahl 10.06.2010 |
Originally Posted by Karlos Santos
have a look ; ) soundcard : maya44 usb |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 10.06.2010 | Video? Screenshots? |
| Sona Nebenzahl 10.06.2010 | IT WORK WITH 1.2.6! tested |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 10.06.2010 | Okey dokey. |
| Sona Nebenzahl 10.06.2010 | because me & a freind are both DJ |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 10.06.2010 | How come you dont just use the Audio 8 soundcard? |
| Sona Nebenzahl 10.06.2010 |
Originally Posted by Karlos Santos
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| Sona Nebenzahl 10.06.2010 | arrrgh xD i uploaded the video, my fail i want only to share you my trick if its patched, well it will not work : ) |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 10.06.2010 |
Originally Posted by Pet
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| nayit ruiz jaramillo 10.06.2010 |
Originally Posted by sj03w4t
Check the YouTube page, it says 1.1.2 (actually it says 2.1.2) also if you pause the video on the bit that shows Traktor Preferences there is no X1 Controller section so its definitely an older version. The hack is patched out. |
| Sona Nebenzahl 10.06.2010 | this was not relesed anywhere... so it must work im on my ibook, so i can |
| Jayne Yellowhair 10.06.2010 | so is this the old hack or does it actually work with 1.2.6? |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 10.06.2010 |
Originally Posted by photojojo
@jesc lol, I ain't gonna start on this. It's old news. |
| Leeanna Ayla 10.06.2010 |
Originally Posted by Pet
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| Cristian Carmona 10.06.2010 | ...? here we go again! |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 10.06.2010 | What kind of feedback are you looking for? |
| Sona Nebenzahl 10.06.2010 | Hey guys, found that thread in google, and its possible to run timecodes on non Traktor Hardware? Yes it is! theres a little how to: First make shure you have an ASIO soundcard with 4x4 in/outs working. You go to start-> Run type in "regedit" and confim Now will open Registry Editor. follow this string: HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE -> SOFTWARE -> ASIO Now you have a selection of folders that are named like your sound card. in my case that it |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 20.01.2010 | Thanks for the explanation. I know just who to take this to. Also thanks for being a 'good sport' as the English say. Like ive said NI were always gonna patch out the loophole in fact the OP even says this in one of his earliest posts so no functionality has been lost by legit users that they werent gonna lose anyway in the interest of software piracy and hardware protection. Im not sure if NI are aware of the legit usage cases but they will now. Ill let you know what/if NI have anything to say. For my part im now gonna back out of this thread. I only entered it because people are still trying to use cracks and loopholes. I believe its better to be up front about the loophole. If people know its gone they may believe twice about relying on torrent downloads and buy Traktor. If they do ill be the first to offer any help if needed. |
| Elisabeth Ferrigno 21.01.2010 | Sorry for the delay, I lost a 3-paragraph post w/ outline due to a browser crash, here's the TextEdit V2, with 99% more bling! Forget I even said anything about Ableton, that was actually a poke @ The Bridge, which is just… routing + gui Also, don't worry about multiple soundcards w/ timecode, that's not the idea. The idea is that for timecode, you need an NI Audio Interface, and I completely agree, that's the way it should work Here I will outline the 2 ways I see to Skin The Cat, and under that, I will explain the use case in layman's terms. Here we go! I. In-Driver Routing for NI Audio X Interfaces (extra button on Audio2/4/8 Control Panel that mimics Jack/JackOSX) A. Pros a. Allows a user to route audio/midi between any app to their little heart's content b. Doesn't require change in Traktor protection, or a change in any NI program, ever! (Cue the TSP works with _anything_, Serato only works with Live! , arguments) c. NI are seen as the heroes that they are B. Cons a. Requires code being added to the Audio 2/4/8 Drivers, although that code could easily be shared between all 3 devices' drivers II. Changing Traktor's Protection to Check for Presence of NI Audio 2/4/8 _Without_ Checking Name of Audio Driver (possibly by checking if USB ID Matching NI Audio Device is Plugged In) A. Pros a. Allows a user to use JackOSX/ Jack for win32 to route audio while still having timecode control b. Should be simple to implement…. but it gets hairy, keep reading B. Cons a. Jack for win32 is not as mature or stable as Jack in OSX (from what I've read anyway)… b. This "fix" directly involves the software's protection. The quicker (or more simple, as per above) the protection is implemented (and since NI can't do an iLOK-type dongle using only the Audio 2/4/8 since they have no flash memory), the easier it will be to crack. Also, it would probably make sense to change the protection slightly, release a new ver of TSP, write the In-Driver Routing, release a new ver of TSP + Drivers, and _THEN_ implement a crazy-assed protection that the crackers give up on, from a programming standpoint. But I guess if that were the case, just fix the drivers and then add protection, skip an interim "Piracy Patch" and get the routing out the door, before Serato gets some more sales…. For use cases, replace Logic w/ favorite DAW ------------------------------------------ USE CASE: Producer Version --------------- DJ TastyCakes makes beats in Renoise and bounces them to tracks in Logic for mastering and scratches. He routes TSP's outputs to Logic's inputs, and starts recording on a 2nd track. When it's time to scratch, Logic records his scratches on track 2, and he has a complete song. __________________________________________________ _________ Use Case: Experimental DJ Version : Live ------ Mitchie Rawtin has a few tricks up his sleeve to make sure _whatever_ he plays has the perfect sound in any club… that nobody can duplicate. He routes TSP into its own track and then adds a few AU effects, even Reaktor 5 effects to the track that is receiving TSP's audio. He can record his set live if he wants to, within Logic, but he doesn't even have to. Since he's running TSP - > Logic -> Out , all the clubbers hear is the realtime version with AU FX ------------------------------------------------------ Use Case: DJ With External Sampler (AIRHORNS!!!!!!!)----- I like to use airhorns. A lot. I believe it's an art to trigger airhorns and drops in time with the mix _while_ mixing, scratching, and beat-juggling. I also like to record my sets, and a perfectly-timed air-horn is one of those things you want to capture as it happens, not fake and re-record later. I route TSP to Logic, record Traktor on 1 track, and record my airhorns on track 2. I throw down and wild out, and it's _all_ there. NOTE: This also applies, and is VERY IMPORTANT for DJs that talk (and even use FX on their voice in realtime!!) while DJ'ing, believe outside electronic music (you see it a _lot_ with Reggae DJs). A microphone can even be plugged into the A8, put on Track 3, and recorded in realtime as well, or any other number of instruments (believe recording Traktor + band, live jam sessions, etc) ------------------------------------------- Use Case: Ableton and Traktor User NI's answer to The Bridge… well, somewhat. They're not going to get Ableton's support (as it's not in Serato's interest), but they can at least interoperate. User A routes TSP to Ableton, and records his scratched sample to a clip (or an infinite number of clips). The backwards end of The Bridge doesn't matter, if you want to play an ableton set in TSP, bounce it to mp3 first Hope this helps, and thanks for being open-minded guys P.S. If this gets pushed through, I'll do the DJTT write-up for OSX. It is truly my only beef with this BEAUTIFUL program, and with Serato jacking 4 decks, FX, _and_ sync, I'd like to help my favorite developers in the world keep ahead. Traktor/NI for the win! |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 20.01.2010 |
Originally Posted by insurgentdjs
ill forward that as a suggestion for legit users if you could outline the legit usage case (in laymans terms) just so i get it cus i dont use Ableton. K |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 20.01.2010 |
Originally Posted by BentoSan
Originally Posted by insurgentdjs
This is why they wont support multiple soundcards.
Originally Posted by insurgentdjs
Originally Posted by insurgentdjs
I should probably say that Im may have come across as a little smug in my 2nd post. I dont take any satisfaction at all if this has prevented any legit users from doing anything . I do take satisfaction if i have helped stop some software piracy. Ive made my opinion on software piracy well known. My views have always been my views long before my NI involvement. I voiced this on the NI community years ago. I know that when i speak people believe im talking with my NI hat on. I dont represent NI on this community . I represent me. It would have been remiss of me not to do something that damages the company whos software i chose to use nearly 6 years ago and i know that many many legit users share my view. This loophole is not popular with the user base. Im a Traktor DJ first and foremost. Id give up my work with NI in a heartbeat if i had to so i could continue using Traktor. (why that would happen i dont know). If peeps believe im a snake in the grass, i ask , would i be so vocal. No id sneek around. If peeps are angry and want to direct it at me (misguidedly) fair dos, ill continue to help with people Traktor queries cus that what i like to do. Peas K |
| Elisabeth Ferrigno 20.01.2010 | The pirated verson doesn't (and shouldn't, _EVER_) have more functionality...... except in this one (edge) case. Sucks, but couldn't be easier for NI to fix (at least in OSX, I forgot how ASIO's routing works, been away from Windows for too long :P). Bento: Right ON! It's all in the details, how NI actually implements it.... I don't care that I have to use my Audio 8, I love my Audio 8, pry it from my cold, dead hands! Just don't check for the device name of the driver, check for the box instead |
| Xavier Emanuels 20.01.2010 | Who said the pirated version have more functionality ? I highly doubt any of the hacker groups will unlock the any soundcard functionality if NI closes the loophole |
| Elisabeth Ferrigno 20.01.2010 | Hmm, I stay the hell away from Youtube for anything technical, so I can't comment too much there. Note that my frustration has nothing to do w/ Ableton, that would just be a side-effect if things were done right. NMX doesn't solve this particular problem, unfortunately, it's just much better than the Fisher-Price Record Button (which for a lot of people is fine/the easiest way for them to simply record and spin a set). Adding a little piece of functionality to drivers that you _NEED_ NI hardware hooked up to use (combined with the closing of said loophole) is NI's perfect TSP anti-piracy solution. Kids using onboard audio for Vinyl control won't show the product in a good light, but you also can't have pirated copies with more features than the legit copies (aside from activation, and let's face it, NI's activation system is fine, at least I've never personally had a problem with it). That just looks _BAD_ and encourages more piracy. P.S.: I'm not asking for some magic midi/osc-synched bridge between any 2 particular programs, just the ability to route Traktor's audio out to somewhere more useful. The magic comes when people start using it P.P.S: Sorry for calling you a troll, I do know that you're quite involved in the community, but that 3rd sentence was a doozy, so I had to prove that there was 1 single solitary edge-as-all-hell case where said loophole was helpful. It just happened to be a big one that surprisingly, nobody else seems to have thought of/banged their head against yet |
| Xavier Emanuels 20.01.2010 |
Originally Posted by Karlos Santos
If NI were to just make sure an Audio 4 or 8 was plugged in to allow the timecode control and not bother which actual interface was in use that would be the best of both worlds for me. Then users could still use jack and timecode at the same time - i believe how they approach blocking out this functionality is very important. |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 20.01.2010 | I hear ya and i understand. NMX will be brought back and then i guess NI are covered. I guess NI got a little bit sick of loads of people posting You Tube videos describing how ro use a Torrent version of Traktor and a Maya or, in the case of one the members of this community a Hercules RMX, with absolutley no interest in a "legitimate use case". The Ableton thing isnt really NIs problem though. NIs problem is software piracy. NI are hit hard by it. Much more so than Ableton and hugely more than SSL which is pretty much unaffected by piracy. Im sure there is another way round it. I dont use Ableton so i dont know. Weve all been watching people start threads and issuing instructions to bypass NIs hardware and make the use of cracked/hacked software all over the place . Did anyone actually expect NI to sit back and let this happen..? There has been an influx of people posting at Traktor community s asking how to achieve ghetto timecode and all state that they have read that it is possible on 'other community s'. One guy actually argued with a member calling him a liar when he stated that he need an NI interface. Im afraid that the popularity of this ghetto timecode thing simply proves that it is primarily being used for illicit uses. Oh and guys, this was gonna be closed anyway. NI discovered it long before this thread. But it was because various You Tube videos and the obvious, blatant illicit use of torrent versions TSP that motivated them to do it. I dare say this thread had a hand in it as well. As for trolling , i dunno. Im pretty involved in this community . I like to help and i 'seem' to have a good rap-our with some members/mods. I didnt really Troll i just didnt get involved cus i posted one post and it all got a bit dramatic so i pulled the post. Im sorry guys but lets take a hypothectical here: Ean Golden and the DJTTs team work really hard and release FW1.3. Its great and loads of us buy it. (it being their hard work) Someone finds a way of flash-updating the VCI from the laptop (like i say hypothetical) thus no need of the DJTTs FW upgrade. You can simple download it from a torrent. Anyone here gonna admit that they would use the torrent? I know i wouldnt . Id buy it. I understand that there may be legitimate uses of the loophole but the damage done by the loophole is VAST and it far outways any legitimate use. I know nothing i can say will convince some people. So be it. |
| Roberto Viccione 20.01.2010 | Ah, gotcha. |
| Elisabeth Ferrigno 20.01.2010 | You can use JackOSX to route its audio with a normal copy of Traktor Scratch Pro, just not with timecode enabled (since you'd be using JackOSX as the "interface," even though it is only acting as a wrapper for the A8DJ. Ruins it for us hip-hop guys, nobody wants to multitrack a midi-triggered scratch chorus w/ no actual scratching Hell, no hip-hop DJ would want to record externally if it means no timecode, period. |
| Roberto Viccione 20.01.2010 | But can't you just route Traktor into Logic the same way Bento has Traktor routed into Ableton? |
| Xavier Emanuels 20.01.2010 | ^^ he has a point I was kinda personally let down by the fact they were going to close this loophole because it means when i get some control vinyl i wont be able to port my audio into Ableton and still be able to use control vinyl. |
| Elisabeth Ferrigno 20.01.2010 | Karlos, you trolled quite well, so well in fact that I had to register an account just to respond. I am a proud owner of TSP, have been since it was released. It is truly a great piece of software; the Photoshop (or better, Pixelmator ) of DJing tools. When I'm gigging, I use my activated copy with my Audio 8, but when I record at home, I am actually stuck using a cracked copy . The "loophole" actually closes a very legitimate use case; that is, the ability to record Traktor's output (while using control vinyl) to a multitrack (Logic), with additional hardware (believe a sampler, I wrote one for my nokia n810 with 32 pads that I use for drops/airhorns, since there is no sampler in Traktor) routed to a seperate track. In fact, using a legitimate copy makes it impossible to use control vinyl and route the audio to anything other than Traktor's internal recorder (which, lets face it, is pretty basic and a far cry from NMX). It also means that instead of doing a mix, and playing with my other gear as well during that mix (and archiving it for posterity ), I'd have to record the entire set in traktor first, then open the wav in a DAW, and play my other gear over it (which doubles the time to record a set, plus completely takes away the 'live' element). I've noticed that you have ties to NI, and if you're _really_ feeling like offering solutions, the solution to this is easy: NI needs to add JACK-esque routing functionality to its Audio2/4/8 drivers. Done deal. Not rocket science either, and it would go quite a long way in establishing that link to that other piece of software that I just don't "get," Ableton Live. At least you'd be able to scratch a chorus on top of a beat and have Traktor send the audio into a clip. Traktor is very important for production, not just live dj'ing, it's very important not to forget that I don't intend to start a flame war or anything, and this particular "feature" is kinda dubious, but you have to remember that this is a professional piece of software, with a lot of power users. Music software unlike any other genre of software, is likely to have completely different uses (and sometimes means to the same end) depending on the user (or superstar DJ). When you remove functionality (or in this case, a loophole), you can also (inadvertently) break the workflow of other paying NI supporters. I guess it just comes down to this: There's always someone that uses the same software that you do, in a way that you'd never imagine (and since we're talking software, sometimes that means doing things you aren't "supposed to do" to make it work). I'd like to hear what you guys believe of this use-case (seems pretty basic to me, Traktor users shouldn't be stuck with either Native Record or external hardware on a hardware mixer to record (I don't even use a hw mixer, midi controller + tables) )/ driver idea. P.S: My multitrack setup is simply JackOSX, Traktor Scratch Pro, and Logic, if anyone was wondering the missing link to actually route the audio. P.P.S.: In-driver audio routing would certainly be a big selling point on NI's Audio interfaces, wouldn't it? Esp. when compared to an SL-1 that doesn't interface with other audio apps AT ALL Also, the in-driver solution would mean that NI wouldn't have to waste time w/ say, a TSP VSTi/AU (which isn't likely anyway), and would have the side effect of allowing a user to use a standalone ver of Reaktor/Absynth/whatever and route its output into Logic/Live/Renoise/whatever (note that in this case, you'd probably be using the VSTi/AU ver of those particular NI apps, but for apps where no VSTi/AU exists..... pure gold! |
| Marshall Aby 19.01.2010 | I'm with you Karlos. At the end of the day people who have paid for their software should not tolerate or offer support to those who have stolen theirs; money lost due to piracy would be spent on making the software better for those that have stumped up for it. |
| juan garcia 19.01.2010 | no no, you see the audio8 makes a lovely flower holder in my prius, no wait i mean i've taken to wearing the audio8 on a chain under my clothes it gives me confidence in board meetings.... that's why i need to use my bcd2000 4in/4out soundcard with my totally legit copy of TSP this loop was a god send you are the devil /lol at those hamfisters *for the record don't use or endorse cracked software. |
| nayit ruiz jaramillo 19.01.2010 | Yep. Ok, heres the skinny. These hamfisted excuses i hear about people who have legit TSP setups (inc audio8) may find the loophole helpful is rubbish. Once you have used the Audio 8 there is no way you will settle for using a fricking Maya. No way. All that may be true but we all know that this is a way to, not only bypass the Audio 8/4 but also making is to tempting to use a torrent version of Traktor. Now aside from the whole stealing Traktor thing there is also the point that the torrent versions are badly cracked/hacked. NI had tested these torrent downloads and found them to be very dodgy. So add "very dodgy software" to a ghetto souncard solution with cheap soundcards and you end up with people with incredibly dodgy DJ setups that are prone to fail and crash. Then these people come on the NI community (and this one) complaining that Traktor is shit and that it crashes on them. Im tired of these people pissing on the product and frankly so are the members of the community that have paid good money for their DVS. Theres also the "i want to demo scratch before buying" excuse. Well i dont buy that. You want to be a digital dj. Cool try the Demo. You believe you might want to use vinyl/CD timecode, great. Creating a ghetto timecode setup form a torrent and cheap soundcard wont help you with getting experience of decks. You still have to have some experience of decks which you have to either buy or borrow. You can get the experience with 2 pieces of regular vinyl. No need for DVS. You buy DVS after you try decks. I kept quiet during most of this thread because of my obvious conflict of interest but, i made it my personal goal to get this loophole closed. And i did. If this makes me unpopular, fine. Ill only be unpopular with people i dont want to be friends with anyway.:eek: |
| Nick Ross 19.01.2010 |
Originally Posted by Karlos Santos
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| nayit ruiz jaramillo 19.01.2010 | Another problem you may encounter is that the Aggregated Loop Hole has been patched out in recent versions of Traktor. You have me to thank for that as well. Your welcome |
| Doug Bieling 19.01.2010 |
Originally Posted by kevzzz
Gav |
| Gregoria Dostal 19.01.2010 | Hey has anyone tried using a maya 44 usb with traktor scratch pro and then using timecode control CDs with 2 CDJS along side the VCI-100 SE? If so, does it work well? I'm believeing of trying out this combo when I get the time to do so at a club with some CDJs |
| Jansen Brown 18.10.2009 | Just tried a friends M-audio conectiv. Works great |
| Delphine Mauser 12.09.2009 | I have been using my Alesis IO 26 instead of my Audio since I found this thread. When I first installed the new Traktor 1.2 update, it seemed as if it didn't work. Today it did! Thats good, however it still seems a bit buggy. Upon startup, sometimes the timecode reads and sometimes it does not. Somtimes i get a weak Timecode signal and sometimes a strong one, wether it's the Audio 8 or the Alesis IO 26. Anyhow I like going without the Audio 8, it's one less USB cable and/or device to use. Currently I run Ableton, Guitar Rig and Traktor all at once, with an APC40, a Korg Nano kontrol, a Turntable, and RigKontrol. Plus the Alesis IO 26. Everything seems to work as anticipated. I'm not sure why Trktor always seems so fickle though. Even using just the Audio 8 and Traktor alone, Traktor seems to have issues for me. I dont always get a signal, and usualy restart Traktor once before a successful run. |
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