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Most DJs suck?

Home :: General Discussion :: Most DJs suck?Reply

Most DJs suck? Posted on: 01.10.2012 by Valeri Holderness Before you read this: by writing this I’m not saying that I’m some super crazy DJ, I still have a lot to learn myself. This is just something I’ve felt for a long time and I’d like to get some insight on how other people feel about this. Also, I’m talking mostly about club djing here. edit: after some discussion, i realized the thread title was a little misleading. just because a dj isn't technical doesn't make them a bad dj, and thats not what I'm going for here I got a chance to see dj spinbad and dj starting from scratch over the weekend (they played a set at a Russell Peters show). Their set was AMAZING and blew my mind. They were doing something truly artistic and were essentially making something new on stage. Slick cuts, juggling, acapellas, etc. It made me believe, why isn’t the standard for djs a little bit higher? Why aren’t big touring djs and resident djs expected to put some skill into what they do? Overall, I believe its safe to say that the majority of djs don’t really engage in the technical aspects of djing; they don’t necessarily “make” something new, they often just beat match between two tunes and call it a day. Some people like to pat themselves on the back for beatmatching, phase matching, phrase matching, etc. but as A-trak said: no one ever complimented a dj on how artistically they beat match. Spending a week learning basic beat matching and having an interest in a specific genre of music (which is something virtually something everyone has) is basically enough to make a mix that would be considered “acceptable”. I find that a lot of djs just reach this acceptable level and then don't feel the need to learn beyond that. Does anyone else see a problem with this? Everyone complains about aoki, guetta, etc. jut hitting play, but how many regular djs do anything more than that? Along with this, its almost become the standard for people to believe of djs as “record player players”. I was reading the paper this morning and the review of the show stated “also appearing was DJ Sarting from Scratch and DJ Spinbad but neither brought much to the evening as canned music would have easily filled the same role”. After perhaps dj craze, these guys played the craziest set I’ve seen in my life. Tonnes of live mashes, cutting etc. between each other all by ear. They were incredibly technical and not messy in the slightest. Also they were about 20 feet away from eachother so they couldn’t communicate or screen peak. Because we’ve set the standard so low, DJs who are actually talented don’t get the props they deserve. Because the majority of DJs themselves are ok with being at the "acceptable" level (and don't strive to do anything necessarily creative), people don't seem to make a distinction between a quality dj and your average joe. sorry for the novel, just something I wanted to discuss here opinions?
Hanna Ridenbaugh 15.10.2012	Tbh the op of "most dj's suck" is in their attitude. We're just spinning tunes and your either good with technical knowledge or need to work on it. No need for the self righteous high horse stuff I keep seeing a lot. Excuse the rant. The title just sort of fitted with my experiences lately.
Dominque Strosser 15.10.2012	Originally Posted by sobi What amazes me is the inability around here to comprehend that there is an answer, and a simple one at that. It's to have a very firm grasp on ALL the things you mentioned. THAT is what a good DJ is. A person who knows ALL the skills of his trade. Not everyone can be a master at all, but a strong DJ will know their weaknesses, but still be able to hold their own on ALL fronts. I agree with this. Here is how i see it I'm a dj I don't produce yet and I'm fully commited to being the best dj I can before I start producing. When I mix i look at my gigs as one big song and each technique and transition used is to take people on a journey the more techniques I have the better I can make that one song.
Lina Rawie 15.10.2012	Originally Posted by sobi what amazes me is the inability around here to comprehend that there is an answer, and a simple one at that. It's to have a very firm grasp on all the things you mentioned. That is what a good dj is. A person who knows all the skills of his trade. Not everyone can be a master at all, but a strong dj will know their weaknesses, but still be able to hold their own on all fronts. ^this!
Darren Teboe 15.10.2012	...
Darren Teboe 15.10.2012	Originally Posted by Ever There's no one answer to any of it. The answers lay in the sixteen pages of posts. Some people want to be technical, some want to play top-10, some want to impress other DJs, some want to dig for unique tracks and take the club on a journey using two CDJ's. Everything beyond this is simply a means to an end - the tools, the techniques, the "being creative/finding new ways." All a means to the ends listed in the second paragraph. What amazes me is the inability around here to comprehend that there is an answer, and a simple one at that. It's to have a very firm grasp on ALL the things you mentioned. THAT is what a good DJ is. A person who knows ALL the skills of his trade. Not everyone can be a master at all, but a strong DJ will know their weaknesses, but still be able to hold their own on ALL fronts.
Malia Janise 15.10.2012	There's no one answer to any of it. The answers lay in the sixteen pages of posts. Some people want to be technical, some want to play top-10, some want to impress other DJs, some want to dig for unique tracks and take the club on a journey using two CDJ's. Everything beyond this is simply a means to an end - the tools, the techniques, the "being creative/finding new ways." All a means to the ends listed in the second paragraph.
Audrey Pinda 16.10.2012	There is also something to be said for a minimalistic approach. Comparing styles of how you DJ, to production... it's like listening to minimal/tech house vs electro house. Both are great in the time and place for it, but you're not going to use them in the same circumstances. The same goes with stylistic approaches to DJing. You can get fancy now and again... but most of the time, just keeping things fluid is the most important thing. Unless you build yourself up to scratch or push boundaries with controllers and software, people on the whole should be going to the club to NOT PAY ATTENTION to WHO is DJing persay, but enjoying the music. I guess that comes down to a big part of it as well. There's a big divergence when it comes to having the DJ be the "center of attention" or "in the background". Lately, it's been more and more of a center of attention style thing, where the DJ is the "rockstar" if you will. But the best clubs I've been to? You can't even see the DJ booth from the dancefloor. This difference of opinion and how a DJ operates is key to how they should be pushing themselves. I believe everyone should be working on bringing something new to the table. But turntable tricks, controller tricks... that's not always the answer. Sometimes people digging for a track for hours and hours and finally finding it? That takes a lot of time and effort too. And that shouldn't be overlooked in this argument. Everyone is pushing the craft in their own way. It doesn't always have to be showy. And those who don't dig deep or push boundaries in other ways? They don't tend to last long. And if they do, well, that's because of outside reasons other than their skills as a DJ.
Julissa Serrone 16.10.2012	Originally Posted by DJSigma Then you're agreeing with me - you're just not reading my posts. That's another thing that DJs are missing these days - an attention span. lol. mmmm.....what were u saying
Celine Surico 16.10.2012	Originally Posted by haze324 Don't know what sync has to do with any of this since the guy who started this thread uses sync in his creative routines. If you aimed this at my response I'm on SSL = no sync. Thing is some of you guys are saying DJ's should do more just because you can or have access to it. I'll tell you I went to hear Eric Sermon play an old school hip hop set and all he did was scratch in the next track song after the song and the place was bouncing and having a great time. There were no amount of effects, loops, transition tricks that he could've done to make that set any better than it was or more important more enjoyable for the crowd that was jamming to his set. So while I do agree that some creativity is needed to separate a good Dj from the next guy, but doing things just because you CAN --- isn't always a recipe for a good set, and if you don't grasp that then by all means go apeshit happy with whatever you find amuzing. + 1 and +1 once again. You could spend hours and hours refining all kinds of wacko techniques but if the house does not rock, it was all a matter of self-gratitude with no real life use at all. I don't believe DJ:ing is about sync/no-sync and doing crazy platter/effect routines, it's about controlling a group of people with music. The sooner new DJs learn this, either the hard way or listening to pros, the quicker they get good gigs.
Lina Rawie 16.10.2012	Originally Posted by haze324 So while I do agree that some creativity is needed to separate a good Dj from the next guy, but doing things just because you CAN --- isn't always a recipe for a good set Then you're agreeing with me - you're just not reading my posts. That's another thing that DJs are missing these days - an attention span. lol.
Julissa Serrone 15.10.2012	Originally Posted by DJSigma Some people just don't get this at all, do they? I get the feeling that if auto-sync didn't exist, this site would have far fewer members. Don't know what sync has to do with any of this since the guy who started this thread uses sync in his creative routines. If you aimed this at my response I'm on SSL = no sync. Thing is some of you guys are saying DJ's should do more just because you can or have access to it. I'll tell you I went to hear Eric Sermon play an old school hip hop set and all he did was scratch in the next track song after the song and the place was bouncing and having a great time. There were no amount of effects, loops, transition tricks that he could've done to make that set any better than it was or more important more enjoyable for the crowd that was jamming to his set. So while I do agree that some creativity is needed to separate a good Dj from the next guy, but doing things just because you CAN --- isn't always a recipe for a good set, and if you don't grasp that then by all means go apeshit happy with whatever you find amuzing.
Brunilda Kora 15.10.2012	Church.
Lina Rawie 15.10.2012	Some people just don't get this at all, do they? I get the feeling that if auto-sync didn't exist, this site would have far fewer members.
Julissa Serrone 15.10.2012	Originally Posted by Patch This is a GOOD thread. Don't close it. People SHOULD question what they are doing - that is how we PROGRESS. Far too many DJ's ("successful" or not...) give themselves too big a pat on the back for being able to beatmatch and EQ. Those techniques are ANCIENT now. But hey, if you've got a evening going with 200+ regular guests, and all you're doing is A>B'ING (maybe you throw in a little filter, or even an ancient flanger or phazer) - good on ya. But at home, and on the community s, we should ALL be asking "what else CAN we do". You don't have to push the boundaries or take risks in front of a crowd - but at home, we should ALL be experimenting like crazy. Pushing boundaries is GOOD. Let's not get content with beat matching and eq'ing. If WE don't push the boundaries, who will? We're the geeks/nerds* at the forefront. Let's not be content when we get a little bit of skill. Experimentation is GOOD. You might have 100 failures - but that 1 instance where something new comes up, that gives you a glimmer of hope that you've discovered something new, you should grab that shit with both hands and practice like fuck until YOU'VE got it down. Then unleash it on a mix, or tell US about it. 'Cos WE'RE not as easily impressed as the 500 "EDM fans" that you may be playing to. *delete as applicable. I don't want the nerds to believe I'm calling 'em geeks, or vica-versa... I hear what you are saying --- but again all this pushing the boundries for what? Just for the sake of being able to DO more "tricks"? Just look at the reaction of many to the kissy vid. "while it looks cool, it sounds like crap" and that's really how most crowds would react. At least the ones I play for. So while I'm not saying that A>B is is all you need. Doing "more" for the sake of doing more just because you can or have access to software that can isn't always a good thing.
Rochel Papillion 15.10.2012	if you feel like critiquing this, go ahead
Brunilda Kora 13.10.2012	This is a GOOD thread. Don't close it. People SHOULD question what they are doing - that is how we PROGRESS. Far too many DJ's ("successful" or not...) give themselves too big a pat on the back for being able to beatmatch and EQ. Those techniques are ANCIENT now. But hey, if you've got a evening going with 200+ regular guests, and all you're doing is A>B'ING (maybe you throw in a little filter, or even an ancient flanger or phazer) - good on ya. But at home, and on the community s, we should ALL be asking "what else CAN we do". You don't have to push the boundaries or take risks in front of a crowd - but at home, we should ALL be experimenting like crazy. Pushing boundaries is GOOD. Let's not get content with beat matching and eq'ing. If WE don't push the boundaries, who will? We're the geeks/nerds* at the forefront. Let's not be content when we get a little bit of skill. Experimentation is GOOD. You might have 100 failures - but that 1 instance where something new comes up, that gives you a glimmer of hope that you've discovered something new, you should grab that shit with both hands and practice like fuck until YOU'VE got it down. Then unleash it on a mix, or tell US about it. 'Cos WE'RE not as easily impressed as the 500 "EDM fans" that you may be playing to. *delete as applicable. I don't want the nerds to believe I'm calling 'em geeks, or vica-versa...
Desire Piedmont 13.10.2012	Play what you like in the style you like and cultivate a scene that will dig it. That is all you need to know and do.
Ming Devis 13.10.2012	Yep this thread is done.
Janyce Henningson 13.10.2012	lol @ this whole thread
Natividad Palilla 13.10.2012	Originally Posted by Ham That was intelligent,i wish you well in your long career playing in your bedroom...
Cindie Somoza 13.10.2012	Originally Posted by chrisneil Where's the music in all this talk of dj ing and skills,comparing a dj to a jazz musician is laughable...We went to the bpm show last yr and someone was showcasing on the pioneer stand,it was a similar type noise to what kissy sell out was doing,its not music is it.
Natividad Palilla 13.10.2012	Where's the music in all this talk of dj ing and skills,comparing a dj to a jazz musician is laughable...We went to the bpm show last yr and someone was showcasing on the pioneer stand,it was a similar type noise to what kissy sell out was doing,its not music is it.
Lashawn Maycock 12.10.2012	I mixed once.... DJ's play records/tunes/music... taste is another matter entirely, I believe the current commercial 'EDM' is rubbish.. but hey ho, it's just one part of the cycle... now if you want some Soulful/Deep/Classic/Old School and Rave Breaks.... go here http://nurave.vmlinuz.co.uk/download...2012-Lofty.mp3 EDIT: I'm a DJ, I mix.. just to clarify opening gambit.
Jolynn Schroyer 12.10.2012	basically all of you suck and i am the best / thread.
Cassidy Galindez 12.10.2012	What makes a DJ good? If the mix sounds good. Period. If they sound like shit, they suck. Maybe they'll get better later, but if their mix sounds bad then for now, they suck. The technical side of things that are mentioned are really beside the point- a DJ is supposed to play music that people enjoy in a way that sounds good; ie: better than playing a CD track-by-track. Sure, some people are better at achieving this than others, and there are those that have a bag full of nifty tricks to accomplish it, but at the end of the day you should just refer to my first point.
Celine Surico 13.10.2012	Maybe some DJs are destined to the same kinds of gigs as advanced jazz musicians. Excellent techniques and chops but restricted to special clubs with selected few attending.
Darren Teboe 13.10.2012	Originally Posted by haze324 To play devils advocate --- do you believe the average club goer gives a crap about using 10 different techniques in a set to transition or are they more worried about listening to their favorite song without someone fugging it all up. I believe it's really a mix of both. I'll give you an example. I went to a show last year during WMC and Richi Hawtin, Loco Dice, Zabiela, Pete Tong and Kaskade were playing. BY FAR the most interesting and techinal set was Hawtin. He has his Traktor set up going with 4 decks, etc. I believe after about 15 minutes of playing I heard someone say "is he going to play the same song all evening " LOL They just didn't get it. Kaskade had played earlier he played on 2 CDJ's and PIO mixer. His set had people dancing, singing along, etc. Grant it was much more commercial, but the average person there could've cared less about the 4 decks and 6 effects Hawtin had going on. I believe you need a combination of skills and talent to play a "great" set -- but more is trickery is always better. Usually the only folks that really judging this kinda stuff are other DJ's. agreed, but there is regular folks (albeit a small number) that "get it". All the showboating is important to some extent though. See my earlier post. Originally Posted by sobi I believe another point of contention (which is correct to a point) is how only DJ's appreciate all the "skill". For the most part, it is right. 90% of the people don't need, want, or care about all the bells and whistles of what a DJ can add beyond basic mixing of great music. Where I believe a lot of people are missing the importance is the few who feel extremely passionate about the creativity. Look at it like this... Part of the reason we a lot of us are here right now is because someone inspired us by doing something that made us go "whoa". That's the creativity and inspiration that propels the FEW, who are likely to push the boundaries and break the mold. If someone didn't do something new that was "crazy" that didn't sound good to most, the Roland TB-303 might never have been used to make acid house, which was one of the foundations of the summer of love. To wish for more "skill" from DJ's, is only to wish for more inspiration from our peers. I believe interviews with guys at the top of their game (like A-Trak) speak to this when they complain about how there is a lot of new guys who play it too safe, to paraphrase him.
Lina Rawie 13.10.2012	Originally Posted by haze324 To play devils advocate --- do you believe the average club goer gives a crap about using 10 different techniques in a set to transition or are they more worried about listening to their favorite song without someone fugging it all up. I believe it's really a mix of both. So I should be an average DJ playing average music for average club goers? Sounds fucking boring to me! Why does Richie Hawtin get booked if he's worse at entertaining a crowd than a guy that's just slamming through the latest hits? Maybe the crowd at his gigs is 100% comprised of other DJs.....
Julissa Serrone 13.10.2012	To play devils advocate --- do you believe the average club goer gives a crap about using 10 different techniques in a set to transition or are they more worried about listening to their favorite song without someone fugging it all up. I believe it's really a mix of both. I'll give you an example. I went to a show last year during WMC and Richi Hawtin, Loco Dice, Zabiela, Pete Tong and Kaskade were playing. BY FAR the most interesting and techinal set was Hawtin. He has his Traktor set up going with 4 decks, etc. I believe after about 15 minutes of playing I heard someone say "is he going to play the same song all evening " LOL They just didn't get it. Kaskade had played earlier he played on 2 CDJ's and PIO mixer. His set had people dancing, singing along, etc. Grant it was much more commercial, but the average person there could've cared less about the 4 decks and 6 effects Hawtin had going on. I believe you need a combination of skills and talent to play a "great" set -- but more is trickery is always better. Usually the only folks that really judging this kinda stuff are other DJ's.
Lina Rawie 13.10.2012	DJs sure like false dichotomies! Here are you choices: - 1. Do no frills basic mixing to play it safe. 2. Use tons of effects, scratching and loops and totally go over the top and ruin it! Or you can choose from this selection instead: - 1. Be crap at the technical stuff, but great at the music stuff! 2. Be crap at the music stuff, but great with the technical stuff! You must choose one of these. There is no middle ground and it's impossible to be great at several things at once.
Darren Teboe 12.10.2012	Originally Posted by chrisneil Or just play great tracks,bashing buttons like a speed freak just makes up for the fact that 90%of edm these days is dire...Yes controllerism is ok is tiny doses,you can ruin a classic house cut by layering effect after effect,looping it to death...This concentration on the dj rather than the music is narcissistic in the extreme... What you are missing is that I'm not saying to be "bashing buttons like a speed freak" or any of that. I really don't understand why it's so hard to grasp for people. While DJ's shouldn't be overdoing it with the showcasing of their skills, they also shouldn't be sitting there doing bland A<->B mixes. There is a spot in the middle which shows plenty of skill without going overboard. Why does everything have to be so black and white for people on this community .
Rochel Papillion 12.10.2012	Originally Posted by NicoTheUnique Agree, i would like to se him do a DJ set like that, at a evening club or something ^^ He does this at a clb, that how he dj
Debra Lagrua 12.10.2012	Agree, i would like to se him do a DJ set like that, at a evening club or something ^^
Lauretta Ehrhorn 12.10.2012	That Kissy set was awful. Lots of technique in there and I know it was to showcase Pioneer but no groove. He's doing trick after trick purely for the sake of it.
Natividad Palilla 12.10.2012	Originally Posted by sobi Only if you choose not to. Scratching really compliments Funky House, Disco House, Jackin House, and almost every sub-genre of Breaks and Drum & Bass/Jungle. If more DJ's were a bit more well rounded, it would be a bit more obvious. Nope. He's asking guys who dj to be well rounded DJ's. There is two ways of going about being a DJ. Being horrible and barely able to mix, or taking incremental steps to getting better by learning all aspects of it, which is what makes it an art as opposed to being a human version of iTunes Genius program, or the cruise mode in traktor. Or just play great tracks,bashing buttons like a speed freak just makes up for the fact that 90%of edm these days is dire...Yes controllerism is ok is tiny doses,you can ruin a classic house cut by layering effect after effect,looping it to death...This concentration on the dj rather than the music is narcissistic in the extreme...
Cindie Somoza 12.10.2012	I have just got into mixing and that was insane! the music Kissy was playing and his technique, wow. Awe inspiring stuff. Damn I wish I didn't suck haha. In due time though!
Celine Surico 12.10.2012	Originally Posted by DJSigma With the gear that's out now, this should be the golden age of DJing. The potential is largely being squandered by people who are using just a couple of the features of their digital DJ gear to make their lives easier, rather than experimenting with all of the features that gear offers to see what the creative possibilities are. Pretty much the same with all the amazing synths out there and people use presets or ask on the community s how to get the exact same sounds as DeadMau5, Laidback Luke. Skrillex...
Lina Rawie 11.10.2012	Originally Posted by Frank488 You're not going to be doing a lot of scratching playing EDM. It sounds like you're asking guys who play house to be more like hip-hop DJs/turntablists. They're 2 different ways of going about being a DJ. It's not just about scratching. The DJs that don't put effort in all tend to mix in the same way. For example, with hip-hop, a DJ that's putting no effort in will often just mix the intro for one song with the outro/last chorus of another, while lowering the bass on the outgoing track. I have heard mixes where every transition is that and the person is using auto-sync and auto-levels, so technically speaking, they're doing almost nothing aside from some basic phrase matching and occasionally twisting an EQ knob. You can use more than 2 decks/sources. You can use any combination of scratching, trick mixing, beat juggling, loops, cue points and effects. You can throw in suitable samples, edit tracks, create live mashups and remixes. There's also a bunch of ways to transition between 2 songs, rather than just doing the same thing over and over again. It doesn't mean that you have to be constantly throwing in all that stuff as overdoing it can detract from the music, but learning your craft means experimenting with it all and with experience, knowing when to use it and how much you should use it. With the gear that's out now, this should be the golden age of DJing. The potential is largely being squandered by people who are using just a couple of the features of their digital DJ gear to make their lives easier, rather than experimenting with all of the features that gear offers to see what the creative possibilities are.
Brunilda Kora 11.10.2012	I wish Kissy Sell Out would play hip-hop, or breaks...
Darren Teboe 11.10.2012	yeah... While the music in the clip (didn't really hear much) wasn't exactly my thing, THAT is the type of skill I believe should be displayed. That type of mixing is what I demand out of myself and what I expect out of the DJ's I listen to playing in clubs.

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