Am I Totally out of my mind thinking this is total garbage
Am I Totally out of my mind thinking this is total garbage Posted on: 06.06.2012 by Sarai Suchman Okay so this is a post off a different community
. People actually believe this post is considered "VALID" Djing. I'm sorry but its shit like this that pisses me off...and further more people actually consider this being a DJ...Fuck me if this is what it has come down to i may as well throw away all my gear."I'm a Virtual DJ program DJ. I line up songs and let the program do a 4 second automix. On most evening s, the most I'll do is change the automix points of songs, so that it comes in when I want it to and cuts off any unnecessary intro's and outro's. I do it for a living, it takes care of me and my wife, and we live pretty comfortably. I have 4 guys who work for me, and last year my company had almost 700 shows. Everything from 12 year old birthday parties to Weddings, plus, mostly, a lot of bars and restaurants. In any given evening we can go from top 40, to old school hip hop, to 90's rock, to country... Whatever seems to fit the mood of the crowd. I charge about $50 per hour with a 4 hour minimum for the basic shows, obviously, much more for Weddings and the more complicated gigs. If I've got a dance floor slammed, and I'm playing a bunch of songs that would go well mixed together, I'll usually do some basic beat matching and mixing within Virtual DJ and throw in a few effects sparingly, but nothing fancy, and frankly, usually people don't know the difference between my beatmatched mix, and virtual DJ's quick automix. In a way, I do it just to look busier. Also, some of the area DJ's that mix give me shit because I'll "press play, and walk away"... But I'm usually off engaging specific people in the crowd. Checking in on the different groups of people, cracking jokes, getting to know the newcomers, basically trying to make damn sure that everybody is having a good time and that they know who I am and that they can and should come up and engage me. I often shake my head when I go on DJ boards and hear people bad mouthing program DJing. I can believe of a bunch of DJ's off the top of my head in my area who mix and work really hard at it, and are pretty damn good at it. But they don't make good and consistent money or get consistent shows, because they don't adapt to different crowds as well. With that said, there are also a few DJs in my area that mix top 40, are really good at it, and are like local celebrities. I'm happy for their success. I would never bad mouth mixing, but there is more than one way to skin a cat. We're all supposedly about the music, I'd rather play 50 random incredible songs that fit my crowd, in their entirety, than 100 similar styled, pretty good songs, that we're beatmatched and cut up. Now, I'm here because I'm trying to teach myself to mix a lot better, and I'd like to start using my NS6 out once in a while if the show seems to call for it. But I definitely wanted to chime in to say that plenty of people out there in my fairly affluent Chicago suburbs have a blast getting drunk while I DJ, and I usually don't mix at all. Song selection is the key for me, I love it when at the end of the evening , the hipsters, dubsteppers, country girls, and top 40 fans are all leaving happy. I love it when I play a track and people go apeshit because it's an awesome song that they forgot existed and they still remember every word... that's my favorite. I love being a DJ, I just haven't needed to mix to love it, or to profit from it. " | |
| Ethel Feigum 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by mostapha
There is a flow to the music that controls the mood and energy of an event, just like a club gig, but without the benefit of a set genre. It requires intimate knowledge of many genres whether you like them or not, quickly reading crowds with diverse age ranges and musical tastes, good public speaking skills, a willingness to deal with requests, and sometimes the need to swallow your pride to make your clients happy. These are aspects of working as a dj, and I believe this deserves more respect than plugging in a usb stick and playing one genre for a few hours. It also makes me waaaay more $$$! People have been called djs since before there was edm, or hip hop, or beatmatching. If you play recorded music for people you are, by definition, a dj. That's it. Doesn't matter what you use, what you play, or HOW WELL YOU DO IT. People seem to believe 'dj' is some special title bestowed upon those with some superior skills and musical taste. It's not, it's just a fucking job title like bus driver or lawyer or porn fluffer, get over yourselves. |
| Werner Bile 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by tokenasianguy
I stopped working as a promoter about 6 years ago, but your numbers sound comparable. |
| Shantae Faile 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by Ed Paris
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| Darlene Strohbeck 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by MWagner
I'm pretty far removed from the local club scene these days, but I remember hearing years ago that one of the resident DJ's in the biggest club in toronto was getting about $1500/evening . I guess it's also a toss-up between getting consistent income every week as a club DJ, vs. hustling for clients as a wedding DJ. The club I used to work in often brought in talent like Nick Warren for around $5,000, but that was 7 years ago. |
| Werner Bile 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by tokenasianguy
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| Darlene Strohbeck 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by sobi
It's true that people at weddings don't want you going nuts on the effects and don't want to hear a song played primarily from triggering samples and one-shots, but the same could be said about top 40's clubs. I throw in some beatmashing and hotcues at weddings but I try to follow the less is more philosophy. If you're not talking about top 40's club DJ's then I guess this is all a moot point. Back when I was primarily a house DJ at a local after hours club, that was probably the furthest thing from DJ'ing at a wedding, because I didn't take requests, and people preferred to hear the freshest, most underground beats. The more obscure the better. Now I tell 12 year old's that I can't play Justin Bieber for them because it'll make me look like I have absolutely no taste. |
| Werner Bile 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by keeb
Honestly, the amount of "mixing" described in the OP is significantly more than I've ever seen a wedding DJ do. |
| Darlene Strohbeck 08.06.2012 | You guys should read this article. It's hilarious. http://www.vice.com/read/hey-v11n5 HEY DJ, FUCK YOU! ANYONE CAN ROCK THE PARTY By VICE Staff You know that thing called DJing? Playing records in bars or at stupid art openings for money? Guess what DJing is? The biggest fucking bullshit con of all time! People who get over as DJs are making the easiest money ever, because they've convinced every PR person and club owner in the world that they're doing something only a few natural-born geniuses can do. It's laughable. A 70-year-old blind Ethiopian leper with 10 broken fingers can "spin" just as well as any B-list celebrity at any instore party for some gay snowboarding jeans company. I promise. And those other guys who do all the little flick-flick, crabby moves on records that are covered with spots of adhesive tape that are supposed to mean something? Those aren't DJs! I don't know what to call them. Nerds, maybe? They called themselves "turntablists" five years ago, but I believe that got embarrassing. One thing is for sure, though: Those guys don't DJ on the actual paying gig circuit that I'm on, because no hammered jock chicks or guidos from West Orange, N.J., will dance to an hour-long abstract scratch frenzy over a P-Funk B-side. I've been making loads of supplementary income by DJing for a few years now, and I can barely even scratch my own back. All you really need is a CD burner, Kazaa, and passably cool taste in music. Here, I'll tell you all about my life as a party DJ: TECHNIQUE FLOW: The only slightly ephemeral skill to learn is flow. Have you ever made a mixtape for someone you had a crush on? Then you already know what flow is—the ability to maintain a mood. I was at a party once where the DJ kept playing one danceable hip-hop track, then one undanceable slow classic-rock track, one hip-hop, one slow rock, on and on like that for an hour! We would get up and dance, and then sit down, and then we finally just stayed down and shot him really dirty looks. It was the opposite of flow. To master flow, you just need to not be a fucking moron. Can you handle that? Segueing from one genre to a totally different one is easy. You just build tiny little bridges instead of taking one big leap. For example, let's go from a hip-hop set to a punk-rock set. You play your last rap song, then a Prince track. Then maybe some ESG. Then the Slits. Boom! You're into the punk before they know what hit 'em. LCD: This is your audience. It stands for Lowest Common Denominator. You are DJing for drunks and cokeheads, and they need the aural equivalent of safety blankets. What would you rather hear when you're high as fuck in a bar: Journey or some obscure acid-house? (If you're a geek, don't answer that.) I used to spend all my time collecting the rarest tracks, stuff that when I heard it at home it would totally blow my mind. Guess what? No one cared. In fact, they stopped dancing. Now I stick to playing stuff that I liked when I was a teenager (the Misfits, "O.P.P.," and songs from John Hughes movies) and I'm golden. When in doubt, go nostalgic. CUEING: This is where you enact the flow thing I just told you about. You have two sides, right and left. When something's playing on the right, believe of a song that would sound good after it. Cue that song up on the left by pressing the same buttons on a CD player that you've pressed 1,000 times before (or putting a needle down in the appropriate groove on a record). When the song on the right side is about to end, slide the little thingy in the box between the decks to the left. When you're a little less than halfway over, press "play" on the CD or "start" on the turntable. Congratulations, you're DJing. Can I get a "That was easy"? PERKS LINES: A huge guilty pleasure is cutting the line and marching right up to the velvet rope all casual, going, "Hi, I'm the DJ." I like to go to a gig dressed like a total slob. The nicer the club, the shittier I look. Then I can stroll past all the people who used to spit on me in high school and make a big huge deal about going through the door first. MONEY: Depending on who you are, a DJ's salary for one evening can range from a few free drinks to obscene amounts (for the big shots) that make you hate capitalism. I heard Paul Sevigny got fucking $15,000 to DJ at Sundance. I hope that is DJ urban legend. Most DJs I know are pretty psyched if they get a couple hundred. Art openings should pay more, like $350. And remember: Always get paid in cash on the evening of. Within 24 hours all money magically transforms into cocaine blown up some model's ass. COMPLIMENTS: One of the best things about DJing is when you play a really kickass song and people come up to you dancing, going "I love this song!" You get all proud and pretend you wrote it. You're like, "Thanks!" Yeah, I downloaded "Youth Gone Wild," I rule. It's like being told your air-guitar skills are fucking SICK. GEAR NEEDLES: Those sleek, aerodynamic, $500 fancy-pants needles are the second biggest scam in DJing besides convincing people that DJing is hard. For totally serviceable needles, go to one of those electronics stores on Canal Street and get the cheapest set possible. You can talk them down on the price, too. I got a pair plus some shitty headphones for $90 after I sweet-talked the sales guy for a minute. (BTW, the cheap needles are called hip-hop needles and that's mean against blacks.) MIXERS: There are a few brands of mixers, but who cares. DJs would like for you to believe mixers are all complicated, but they're really about as hard to figure out as a home stereo. I once spun at this lesbian party where I ended up giving girls DJ lessons all evening . They were lined up across the room, and it only took me a few seconds to show each of them the basics. As Garfield would say, "Big fat hairy deal." Once I showed them how simple it really is, they were shocked at the big deal that people make about the whole thing. Yeah, there are cute little tricks you can do. If you're playing a hip-hop song, it's fun to cut out the bass after the second verse and then kick it back in full force on the chorus. It's a nifty party trick and it makes girls lose their shit. But you can also just say, "Fuck it," set them all in the middle, and read a book in between tracks. WHEELS OF STEEL: Please don't call them that. Don't call them "the ones and the twos" either. It sounds like your mom saying, "Homie don't play that." ETIQUETTE OOPS: You're going to fuck up. The record will skip or you'll be distracted by some drunk kid telling you how much "Bizarre Love Triangle" means to him or you'll let two Wire songs play in a row. No big whup. Everyone's too wasted to care. You should be too. Just take the opportunity to make announcements. I usually shout out important information such as, "Don't stop the rock, motherfuckers!" or "I need to pee!" REQUESTS: Try not to cry when people request Missy Elliott, again. Or "Hey Ya!" or "Milkshake." Or Cher when you are spinning Minor Threat. Or simply "hip-hop." Or any genre of music, in fact. You wouldn't believe how often people request an entirely different genre of music than what the DJ is playing. It's infuriatingly rude. You're telling the DJ that you hate his or her music. If you don't like what I'm playing, wait 10 fucking minutes and I'll be onto a new thing anyway. If you simply must request a song, it better be within the scope of what I'm playing at that very second AND it better be such an insane song that it'll make me go, "Oh shit, yeah, why didn't I believe of that?" True fact: That's only happened to me once out of hundreds and hundreds of requests. The song was "Sweet Emotion" by Aerosmith, believe it or not. SAVING YOUR BEST STUFF: This is tricky. You don't want to blow your load before the evening hits maximum party time, so you squirrel away your guaranteed crowd-pleasing monster jams and you wait, believeing, "Now? Now? Do I drop it?" And finally you're like, "It's time, I'm gonna hit it." And boom! It's a fuckin' nuclear-bomb explosion. A roomful of people you would barely be able to look at in the daytime are freaking out like they just won the lottery, all because you pressed a button. That's why you do this shit. That, and the fact that you are a total fucking spaz. By VICE Staff 7 years ago |
| Darlene Strohbeck 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by VanGogo
I don't believe that it's professional to just hit auto mix and go talk to the crowd though.
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| Darlene Strohbeck 08.06.2012 | How does he do weddings or take requests if his sets are pre-programmed? Also how good is Virtual DJ's "automix?" Traktor's "cruise" feature only seems good as creating constant trainwrecks. It's quite puzzling how club DJ's are the ones that usually have the real skill, but they tend to get paid less (at least in Toronto), than the wedding DJ's who often tend to be the biggest hacks. I recently heard of a wedding DJ that charged $1200 and showed up with his Macbook which he plugged directly into the sound system and proceeded to play full-length tracks from iTunes out of his headphone output. |
| Iraida Linihan 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by mostapha
Originally Posted by mostapha
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| Dorie Scelzo 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by sdrthedj
Originally Posted by sdrthedj
I don't want to take away from what your skills are, and I thank you (and every other mobile jock out there) for dong it so we don't have to…but those skills are not DJing. Please feel free to argue with me on this one…I want to read someone tearing me a new one for this opinion…it'd make me feel better about humanity. |
| Iraida Linihan 09.06.2012 | It's kind of sad reading posts like these. I didn't know the form was actually called 'CDJTTO' or Club Disc Jockey Tech Tools Only, not DJTT. I thought the purpose of DJTT was to provide a gathering place for like minded people who like to use newer technology, get help and support, and learn new things. I'm a mobile jukebox, wannabee, not a real dj. I use a Traktor, and a Kontrol S4. It makes doing my job easier and more fun. Beatmatching? Rarely. Fun effects and mashes? Pretty much never. Someone who likes to learn new technics, about new technology and different way's to do things? Absolutely. That's why I enjoy the form . To the OP, and other's who don't have much respect for what mobile jukebox's do: Maybe we don't DJ in a way that meets your standards, but I will bet that most mobile's are better MC's, are amazing at reading a crowd, and would suprise you with how diverse there talents can be. |
| Dorie Scelzo 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by keeb
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| Ok Moroski 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by djproben
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| Dorie Scelzo 08.06.2012 | He's a mobile DJ. Mobile DJs and club DJs are different breeds. Frankly, I believe that virtual DJ's automix is too much effort for a mobile DJ. If he's playing in clubs, well, I feel sorry for the area because they must not know what music is. |
| Leeanna Ayla 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by djproben
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| Danae Dumler 08.06.2012 | OK so if Guetta is doing it, that's fucked up; he gets the big bucks and is considered a star because he supposedly knows what he's doing as an artist, not a party clown. This guy is making a living as more of a party clown - he isn't just doing nothing and pushing play; he's cracking jokes, getting to know people, checking out who's having fun, probably saying stupid shit on the mic that the groom's mom wants him to say, convincing a bridesmaid she doesn't look fat in that dress, etc. He probably knows all the hand gestures for YMCA and the Macarena and has ten different versions of Hava Nagila on his hard drive, he will be able to nod and smile knowingly (and sincerely) when he plays the Beach Boys and aunt Sarah tells him how much she loves this song, and he will be able to pretend "We Speak No Americano" is a brand new song when cool Uncle George comes up to ask the name of it. No, it doesn't take the same skills as beatmatching (frankly it's probably a lot harder and more challenging in many ways), but trust me this guy is earning his living. |
| Ok Moroski 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by Gapout
What it comes down to though is that mobile DJing is not about skill; it's about marketing and presentation. You can be the best mobile DJ in the world, but if you don't get word out to potential clients you're dead in the water. This guy is clearly a solid businessman but I'll be damned if I'll call him a DJ. Next thing it'll be, "yeah, making a 'mix cd' makes you a DJ - it's all about song selection." Does an iPod playlist count? How about a Pandora radio station? Where have the standards gone? Even if this guy possibly meets the dictionary definition of a DJ, and even if you consider song selection to be paramount to the art, calling him a DJ is an utter farce. /rant |
| Werner Bile 07.06.2012 | I don't want to upset the OP but there are also thousands of people who are considered DJs who don't even pick their own music and mostly just talk on the radio in between the songs. They have about as much to do with what we do as this guy does. |
| Leeanna Ayla 07.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by Yul
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| Jolynn Schroyer 07.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by Ed Paris
I got traktor 2.5 but no mixer. Just my keyboard and built in laptop speakers. Its fucken really annoying to learn with no mixer. Graghhh i should have never returned my mixer but i wasn't learning anything by having one. Atleast i got traktor 2 for free once i returned my mixer. Seriously though, if you have good taste in music. You'll get paid just for that. |
| Kiyoko Wellisch 07.06.2012 | Guy got paid 700 times and counting. That's legit and more impressive than being nifty with a fader. |
| Kecia Wnukowski 07.06.2012 | Music selection > technical skills. |
| Alla Bluemke 07.06.2012 | uh dudes basically a wedding dj/small party dj. Those gigs are a dime a dozen. You don't need mixing skills to do any of those gigs at all. He makes a living off it. Thats it. Its not like he's interested in the art of mixing. DJing can be seen in multiple ways, from vinyl all the way to prepared ableton sets, how is this any different? Its barely any different than a sync "DJ" so what are you getting at? |
| Aundrea Lenore 07.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by VanGogo
People need to put more effort into honing THEIR craft instead of worrying what others do. This will result in a better product for all. DO YOU. |
| Marica Wehler 08.06.2012 | I don't see a problem with this really. Like others have said he seems to be enjoying himself and it is paying his bills. That part is the most important imo. Paying Bills. It's his lively hood and if it gets the job done it gets the job done. |
| Erich Vallabhaneni 08.06.2012 | He's just doing his thing trying to make a living for him and his wife, and as said above he's a wedding/kids parties dj so unless you're aiming at 12 year old kids or wedding folk as your target audience then there shouldn't be a big deal. You coulda used this time for practice |
| Eleonor Janski 08.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by deevey
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| Jona Slon 07.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by MWagner
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| Rosenda Gossage 07.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by firebr4nd
Personally, I'd rather play some tunes that whine about what someone else is doing. *shrugs* |
| Hipolito Scionti 07.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by deevey
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| Ulysses Vittetoe 07.06.2012 | This rant would would be applicable if he were a club DJ and not a mobile DJ. |
| Rosenda Gossage 07.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by deevey
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| Rolanda Clodfelder 07.06.2012 |
the reason why i am hating, is because its people like this that will eventually destroy the DJing industry.
Mobile/commercial DJ's are one of those people who's job I do not envy. It can be decent money, would drive me completely insane and It's much harder IMHO to play and satisfy a cross generation crowd who wants everything than a crowd who wants <insert x genre here> for 4-8 hours. This won't destroy your "art" in any way, and he came to a message board to try to learn more, whats wrong with that ? |
| Werner Bile 06.06.2012 | seriously. Am I supposed to be mad that he's isn't mixing like a club DJ when he plays weddings and birthday parties? Who cares. |
| Nita Eviston 06.06.2012 | i believe a few people on here are forgetting that mobile/wedding djs are an entirely different school of believeing than most members of this blog's community
. Where as we aspire to the dj being the centre of attention, mashing cues, beatmatching, scratching, practically putting on a live show, a mobile/wedding dj is meant to be creating a mood without imposing on the crowd. If you were at a wedding and some dj was beatmashing the crap out of some track while you are trying to have a nice meal, or a formal dance, you'd be pissed and probably quickly replace him with an ipod. This style of djing is not what people attend evening clubs (well, most evening clubs). It certainly would not appear at a evening club/festival that any of us would aspire to, or even accept a gig at. So to OP, get over yourself mate, this is completely different to what you do. |
| Darren Teboe 06.06.2012 | Forgive me if it's already been said, but you should all be embarrassed of yourselves for the fact that you let this thread get to three pages of dickwaving and soap boxing about what a DJ should be without acknowledging the fact that this guys has nothing to do with DJing like we do, or DJ's like we are. To spell this out, he is a MOBILE DJ, which is a world away from what a CLUB DJ does. |
| Roseanna Signorini 06.06.2012 | Every style of DJ believes that every other style isn't really DJing. Its always been this way. The fact is the easiest way to make decent money on a regular basis is to be a mobile DJ. Its also the best way to learn the DJ business no matter what style of DJing you do because every DJ starts out doing a house party which would be considered like a mobile gig It teaches you how to deal with clients, how to deal with requests, reading the crowd, etc. Now depending on the gig and depending where you are in the world depends on your rate. This guy said he charges $50 an hour for at least 4 hours, thats only $200, thats pretty cheap actually. Factor in the setup and breakdown, gas money, time put into to advertising, calling clients to get the gig etc. He is playing music for people and getting paid for it, he is a DJ. You can call him whatever you want, human jukebox, whatever, doesn't matter, 700 shows a year means he is booking multiple parties for 1 day. People are hiring him. Don't hate, its not going to ruin club DJing, no club is going to ever have music on auto, not going to happen. |
| Lela Umanskaya 06.06.2012 |
Originally Posted by VanGogo
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