Need buyer's advice: Budget solid controller for old school vinyl DJ?
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Need buyer's advice: Budget solid controller for old school vinyl DJ? Posted on: 04.07.2011 by Robbyn Student OK. ...I'm looking for advice on a new controller that is moderately priced ($150 - $400) that is sturdy, easy to map and tweak, has a few different .tsi maps available for Traktor Scratch Pro 1.2.7 or better, and will have above average curve adjustment and jog wheels for scratching.I already have an Audio8, so having a built in sound card is not necessary. I consider myself to be an advanced DJ but a bit new to using strictly a controller to spin. I've used timecoded vinyl for a few years but want a controller for quicker gigs so the club doesn't need to dust off their 1200s specially just for my hour set. I also do not want something that looks like a toy that I can play out @ some of the bigger venues without being snickered at by anybody who bothers to look at what I'm using. So far Reloop, Numark, B52, and Vestax seem to be where I'm leaning...but I'm having issues narrowing down which flavor of which model to run with. I spin Electro House, Dubstep, and mashups. HELP. | |
| Nisha Latkowski 11.10.2011 |
Originally Posted by haze324
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| Ralph Alderette 11.10.2011 |
Originally Posted by MrPopinjay
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| Ok Moroski 12.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by B-Naut
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| Robbyn Student 11.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by sgb
Secondly, I never said anything about needing, requiring, or even wish for a moving platter. Third, knowing that scratching directly on a controller is likely a bad option, I am now looking toward a good controller to use to mix and control effects and use an external CDJ or turntable to scratch. Therefore I now need a good controller that has an auxiliary input that I don't need to sell a kidney to buy. (Much like the DJTT blog entry showing DJ Dummy scratching on turntables connected to the S4. But I prefer a less expensive controller to set up the same way.) |
| Julissa Serrone 09.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by B-Naut
VCI-300 = works awesome with Itch. It's the best platter response on a controller (aside from the NS7/V7). Platters work like shit with Traktor. VCI-100 = The 1.4 FW gives the jogs higher resolution, but they are still not as good as what the 300 does with Itch. The platters are also smaller. It's not for scratching. The V7 gives you the best controller resposne, but you'll still have the same issue at the club swapping out gear. |
| Breanne Penge 12.10.2011 | And how is the scratching on the S4 coming along? Miss the vinyls yet? |
| Deeann Cheron 11.10.2011 | Practice your dance moves. nuff said |
| Nisha Latkowski 11.10.2011 |
Originally Posted by haze324
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| Ralph Alderette 11.10.2011 |
Originally Posted by MrPopinjay
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| Kiyoko Wellisch 10.10.2011 | 4 deck mixing- go! |
| Robbyn Student 10.10.2011 | UPDATE : After some weighing the pros and cons, I sprung for the S4 when DJTT had it discounted with the Traktor 2.0 upgrade last July. When I showed my wife that you could plug in a pair of 1200s into the S4 as channels C and D, she said "I don't care what it costs. You NEED this!" She has never said that about any other piece of my studio. I grabbed my credit card and bought the S4 before she had a chance to change her mind. All in all, I am very happy with my S4. Setup and mixing with it is a snap. My only issue is my own problem: I am having to readjust my overall mixing style a little. Because the controller is so easy to browse for tracks, set the next song, and mix it in (with or without Sync)...I find myself with my hands a bit too idle. When I used vinyl or vinyl control, I could always keep myself busy and constantly tweak something. There is a lot more instant stage presence IMHO with turntables. Now with my S4, in between mixing in my next song, I feel the need to try harder to look more interesting otherwise I look bored without meaning to. ...Again, that is my own issue and nothing to do with the S4 as a whole. |
| Kiyoko Wellisch 10.10.2011 | That's even more expensive than turntables and controllers put together though... :P |
| Rolande Posso 09.10.2011 | Seriously fuck all the controllers and just use the CDjs if you can mix and scratch on techs you can use CDjs ! |
| Zelda Verna 09.10.2011 | http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3hdncoP9agY |
| Ok Moroski 12.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by B-Naut
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| Robbyn Student 11.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by sgb
Secondly, I never said anything about needing, requiring, or even wish for a moving platter. Third, knowing that scratching directly on a controller is likely a bad option, I am now looking toward a good controller to use to mix and control effects and use an external CDJ or turntable to scratch. Therefore I now need a good controller that has an auxiliary input that I don't need to sell a kidney to buy. (Much like the DJTT blog entry showing DJ Dummy scratching on turntables connected to the S4. But I prefer a less expensive controller to set up the same way.) |
| Kiyoko Wellisch 11.07.2011 | I believe the Stanton SCS 1D was supposed to work well with traktor but I am not entirely sure. may want to do some research. Either way it is outside the price range. |
| Elia Ajram 11.07.2011 |
Which controller out there is best for the job? New specs needed:
- high res wheels - good with Traktor Scratch Pro 1.2.7 or better - optional 4 deck usage (not a deal breaker with only 2 deck control) - lots of easily mapable knobs, buttons, and faders - AUX INPUT FOR CD OR TURNTABLE - built in sound card optional - does NOT look or feel like a plastic toy - weighs less and is more portable than a crate of vinyl records - hopefully under $400 (could be more if it can be absolutely and easily justified to my wife) NOW how do my options look? The remaining options are Numark NS6, Pioneer DDJ-T1, Pioneer DDJ-S1, and the NI S4. I cannot attest to the scratch performance of the jog wheels, but my preference would probably be the NS6 because the size of the jog wheels (although I'm not certain on how well it works with Traktor, its is an Itch controller). I would rule out any jog wheel that does not have visual feedback of movement of the track for scratching. That is, the VCI's, the reloops, and any other controller that doesn't output some sort of visual marker of the position of the track on the jog wheel (because looking at the screen does not work well). For instance, the NS6 has the white marker on the jog wheel, with vinyl we typically have a sticker, and so forth. To be honest, scratching with Traktor only works well as a DVS. And any controller with jog wheels is not going to be any better than CDJs for scratching. I believe the only viable options for scratching require Itch. |
| Robbyn Student 09.07.2011 | OK. Now that I know that finding an advanced controller that can scratch is damn near impossible (and knowing is half the battle), the next best thing would be to grab a good controller with a built in auxiliary input to tap a CDJ into as a third deck dedicated for scratching. While I like the idea of the V7 being able to scratch, they are not sold as a pair, they appear to be big bulky + heavy. I would still need to rewire the entire booth set up. The hack for them to make them useful for Traktor seems to be a roll of the dice when it comes to stability. All these reasons point to the V7 as being a good option to scratch with, but not the smartest choice as a whole. So my believeing at this point is, if I were to have a controller with a built in sound card compatible with Traktor that has an auxiliary input...all I need to do is wire the main out to one line in of the club's mixer...connect a CDJ to my controller ...plug in the USB from the controller to my laptop and I'm ready to rock. Rearranging three wires as opposed to resetting a whole DJ booth to swap out and rewire it all before and after seems a hell of a lot more simplified. In the end, I still would have left the second CDJ already in place to allow the next DJ to get started with zero interruption. Smooth. Streamlined. I like this plan. Which controller out there is best for the job? New specs needed: - high res wheels - good with Traktor Scratch Pro 1.2.7 or better - optional 4 deck usage (not a deal breaker with only 2 deck control) - lots of easily mapable knobs, buttons, and faders - AUX INPUT FOR CD OR TURNTABLE - built in sound card optional - does NOT look or feel like a plastic toy - weighs less and is more portable than a crate of vinyl records - hopefully under $400 (could be more if it can be absolutely and easily justified to my wife) NOW how do my options look? And why has nobody answered my question about Reloop? |
| Kiyoko Wellisch 09.07.2011 | I'm pretty sure the issue is the platter rather than the fader. |
| Adrien Hochstrasser 09.07.2011 | I can't remember exactly, can you swap out the fader on the VCI-100? If you swapped out the fader for a high quality one, and put in some arcade buttons, that might work well for your needs. You'll probably find it a little small and toy-like though. |
| Julissa Serrone 09.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by B-Naut
VCI-300 = works awesome with Itch. It's the best platter response on a controller (aside from the NS7/V7). Platters work like shit with Traktor. VCI-100 = The 1.4 FW gives the jogs higher resolution, but they are still not as good as what the 300 does with Itch. The platters are also smaller. It's not for scratching. The V7 gives you the best controller resposne, but you'll still have the same issue at the club swapping out gear. |
| Jason Kruml 08.07.2011 | this is what you need right her: http://www.djranking s.com/community /showthread.php?t=33207 |
| Robbyn Student 08.07.2011 | I almost forgot. Both the VCI 100 and 300 were mentioned. What are the differences with using them to scratch? I love the option to switch to Decks C + D but again, not a deal breaker if it's not there. |
| Robbyn Student 08.07.2011 | "Don't be a cunt." Seriously. It's just not that critical that we can't keep this civil. Play nice. So far I believe Nada may have some scratching skill and could be closer to pointing me in the right direction. The touch strip scratch thing? I'm believeing I may be better off trying to scratch a sample by grabbing a mouse, twirl it over my head, and hope for the best. I just don't see it as a good option. I've notices a few patterns with the stream of replies on this thread: - It seems finding something that can scratch using Traktor (and yes, I prefer Traktor over Serato because I like tinkering with my controllers and MIDI maps and the effects are awesome) is a taller order than I anticipated. - Even moreso, it seems to be a tougher request to find one that can scratch that is within my budget. That's OK. If I need to save up more cash to get exactly what I need, I'm OK with that. Now perhaps I wasn't clear as to WHY I was attempting to cross over from scratching with timecoded vinyl to using a controller, hopefully that has a way to scratch and won't change my routines much. There is a method to my madness. 1.) The clubs I frequently play in typically have a high end Pioneer CDJ system set up. Most of the other DJs who play there either use a control deck or the CDJs. The result? The sound tech has to come in the booth and remove the CDJs while the music keeps playing from the previous DJ, dust off the rarely used Technics 1200s, rewire the mixer to my Audio8, wait until I do a sound check hoping everything works OK before the last song ends...then after I do a 2 hour set, he has to do all that in reverse so the DJ after me can use the CDJs again. Yeah, he seems OK with doing it. But I just feel like it is a lot of trouble to go through each time I get a gig there. I don't like being that "special case" DJ. It reeks of having this snobbish quality that I do not need added to my image. Grabbing something I can plug in and roll with on my own would avoid all of this. 2.) I want to book more outdor festivals. I did one summer fest a few years ago and ruined a few rare limited press white label records because the promoter cut the canopy that was to cover my end of the stage from the budget. It was July in 90 |
| Rolanda Clodfelder 08.07.2011 | Suprised no-one mentioned the Stanton SCS.D1 ...Someone around here was selling one recently for about $400 if I remember right and the Traktor Bugs were apparently fixed. Worth a Look. |
| Julissa Serrone 07.07.2011 | I'm with DJ Nada on this one Controller + Scratch = a Serato Itch product VCI-300 you could find used for 400 bucks. Jogs work like shit with Traktor. Work great with Itch V7 they had a deal with a rebate that one came out to 299.00. You can pull of tons of high level scratches. There's nothing in the Traktor line up that can match those two for scratching. The S4 is capable, but not optimal and also out of your price range. Not sure if you heart is set on Traktor, but don't sleep on the next version of Itch due out very soon. |
| Kiyoko Wellisch 07.07.2011 | Honestly I don't have much faith in it but I'd like to see what it's capable of. I don't really see any reason why a touch strip wouldn't work. If anything I'd argue that if a touch strip precise enough was developed that it be superior to a platter, though I'd have to be substantially larger than that of the twitch. Also it'd probably be better rotated 90 degrees. You wouldn't be able to juggle though |
| Adrien Hochstrasser 07.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by MrPopinjay
Not knocking the Twitch, it's a genius product for electro-oriented DJ's, but is completely useless for a scratch DJ. |
| Kiyoko Wellisch 07.07.2011 | We've yet to see what they are capable of. I'm sceptical but I'm reserving judgement. |
| Ok Moroski 07.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by MrPopinjay
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| Adrien Hochstrasser 06.07.2011 | Actually, that's not a bad suggestion. The fader is good, the upfaders are very good, and the jogs are high resolution. I actually learned to scratch on the VCI-300. It's not ideal though, and a little out of his price range I believe. |
| Kiyoko Wellisch 06.07.2011 | This guy is interested in scratching on a controller and yet no one has mentioned the VCI 300. And yes, I know it has an internal soundcard but generally all the controllers without one suck for scratching. +1 on the V7 as well. I'm not sure why you're calling the Twitch royally stupid though, I believe it's a fuck load better than the Omni Control and the Mixtrack, both are pretty much toys. |
| Adrien Hochstrasser 06.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by Topps
The mixtrak-> budget controller, but decent jog wheels The VCI-> Not useful for scratching Twitch->WTF? That's royally stupid Omni Control->Decent suggestion, useless for scratching X1 and CDJ'S->Again, WTF?!? Do you know how much the good CDJ's cost? "You can't scratch on a controller"->Wrong, yes you can. I do it all the time. "I touched a V7 once and it felt nothing at all like proper vinyl and with the size of the thing, you're not going to do any decent scratching"-->This is freaking ignorant. You can scratch like a monkey in a CDC lab with the V7. In conclusion, the best option in his price range is the V7. It doesn't quite work with traktor yet, but there are workarounds. Controller+scratching=V7 In a much higher price range, you could also check out the Denon DN-S3700. They are amazing! I hope to own two of them someday. |
| Jacquelyn Swiatkowski 06.07.2011 |
Originally Posted by B-Naut
Originally Posted by DJ Nada
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| Ok Moroski 06.07.2011 | In addition, since the v7 would then be controlling itch you'd have to use bomes mt or an equivalent to send signal to both Traktor and itch. I wouldn't recommend it tbh from what I've seen. |
| Jason Kruml 06.07.2011 | fyi the V7 "hack" for traktor is to import the traktor control cd as an audio file, then open BOTH Itch and traktor and load the control file into the Itch decks, then you can operate the V7 like a cdj in traktor. Its an unrealistic workaround. Also, no love for my V7 post? thanks. |
| Robbyn Student 06.07.2011 | Cool! NOW we're getting somewhere. Thank you Nada. I looked at a few tutorials on YouTube on how to use the V7 by somehow linking Itch to TSP. (Which, I'm still a bit fuzzy on how it was done, but I suppose I'll deal with that later if I have to.) Aside from that, the Novation Dicers were originally "designed specially for use with Serato" (just like the V7) and then somebody came along with a quick .tsi file fixed that little red wagon rather quickly. ...All I'm saying is where there's a will, there's a way to hack the effing mess out of a V7 to make it do your bidding for Traktor. I like where this is going, but honestly is the Numark V7 my ONLY option that will fit my needs? Is there an alternative that would offer 2 or 4 deck control in the SAME singular unit (rather than buying 2 V7s)?? |
| Adrien Hochstrasser 05.07.2011 | Alright, ignore everything in the first page of this thread, that's crap from guys that don't/can't scratch. A Twitch? Are you effin serious? $5 says someone recommends a S4 in a little bit. Get a Numark V7, I have one, it's great for scratching as long as you have a good computer that can run it at a lowish latency. It doesn't feel or look like a toy, it's solid metal and heavy. I don't know anything about running it with Traktor, but it's probably your best solution. The great thing is that you can run two decks with one V7, there's a Deck A/B switch. I've even managed to beat juggle with it. (Not recommended live) |
| Neville Blackinton 05.07.2011 | I had a Mixtrack and I loved it. You can't buy a better controller for < $150. |
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