Which controller to get? Traktor S2?
Which controller to get? Traktor S2? Posted on: 31.10.2011 by Noma Micu Hi, I'm looking at getting a new controller to (finally) upgrade my Behringer BCD3000.I'm looking at a few options and I'm willing to spend up to around | |
| Barton Rigazio 01.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by Nibbsy
I do take the time though to beat-grid most of my tracks. It's really simple in Itch and I actually believe the elastic gridding in Itch is much better than the beat-gridding in Traktor. Most ppl are used to Traktor already though so it's no biggie for them. Just wanted to clarify! Itch rocks woot! |
| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by Jiggle
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| Darwin Roozeboom 06.06.2012 | I use the Traktor S4 and it totally rocks. If you can afford to splash the cash then go for the S4 otherwise the Traktor S2 is a great option to run with. You could always save up and get an x1 at a later stage to add and use the effects. |
| Noma Micu 22.11.2011 | I fully agree. I bit the bullet and bought an S4 last week and not regretting it at all. Like you say I've had to spin the decks round to make them fit, but it's a small price to pay. The S4 does absolutely everything I need it to and does it absolutely seamlessly. It also does a helluva lot more that I'll probably never even use. Cheers all for all your help, and if anyone is reading this in the same position then just get the S4, you won't regret it. |
| Lianny Paris 21.11.2011 | i was so in your position years ago. this was the answere: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P7jRcLNSoGo see how small those controllers are? they also have a built in souncard! i have since moved onto the s4 and like you i was concerned about deskspace. when the s4 arrived it didnt fit between the 1210. i quickly figured out if you spin your 1210's 45 degrees into battle position maybe your s4 will fit. i went to hell and back trying to find a controller without losing vinyl control with a small footprint, during my research into this i went through tp2- serato scratch - torq/connectiv - eks xp10. from my research i can tell you that the s4 with the scratch upgrade pack was the ultimate and current answere. listen to me and others on hear the answere is stearing you in the face. s4 baby! |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 | Haha, yeah. I have no doubt that if I went to a store I would get talked into getting the S4. I'm still in 2 minds between the S2 plus extras or just the S4, but at least I've narrowed it down to those 2 options. Cheers for all your help, feel like I'm in a much better position to make a decision now than I was a few days ago. |
| Jarod Perrodin 02.11.2011 | I live in Southampton, there are some good stores nearby. The s4 is an amazing piece of kit, If money where no object I'd have 5 or 6 The S2 does what I wanted for a good price & as I already had the audio 8 it worked out well. Store's will generally steer you towards something more expensive. Which is always nicer |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 | Yeah you're right, 3 ins and outs. I will look into how much I can get an Audio 6 for, thanks. nicoga3000 - good suggestion, cheers. Unfortunately I'm in the UK so it would probably cost me the price of S4 to explain what I'm looking for over the phone! I did take your advice though and phoned a UK store, but the guy I spoke to knew A LOT less than you guys, and even I was having to correct him on a few things. DJ Ninja he was not. Unfortunately retail customer service over here isn't quite as good as the US |
| Jarod Perrodin 02.11.2011 | Yeah I believe an audio 6 would have enough for what you want. I believe the audio 6 has 3 stereo ins & outs. |
| Bertha Fathy 02.11.2011 | Just a thought Nibbsy - you COULD call the DJTT store customer service on this. If you've got an idea on what controller you want (which from everything you've said, the S2 is what you're aiming for...although I'm still convinced that the few extra inches of the S4 would serve you better, haha), they are probably able to help you make your decisions. Maybe, maybe not? I've never called, but I know it says on the store page, "Contact our DJ Ninjas 1-877-246-8958". Just a thought! |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 | Ok I believe I get it now, thanks. Would an Audio 6 work for these purposes? I believe it has 2 ins and 4 outs. Is that right? How many ins and outs do I need? |
| Jarod Perrodin 02.11.2011 | Its fine, I already had the audio 8, thats why I hooked it up like I have. I have no audio leads coming from the S2, the audio 8 does all of the ins and outs. The S2 i use as a controller. You choose the audio 8 in traktor audio setup. Having the audio 8 just makes it alot more flexible. If you didnt want to use decks you wouldn't need it, the S2 has master, booth & cue outputs. So If Im not using the decks I dont need the audio 8. |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 | Thanks Jiggle, that's a very good point about the software being included in the price. You do sound like a big fan, and it's reassuring that you like it so much. Would you mind going into just a bit more detail about how the S2 fits together with the Audio 8? Where do the audio leads plug in to each box? Sorry if I keep asking the same questions but I really want to get my head round it! |
| Jarod Perrodin 02.11.2011 | Excellent jog wheels Ready to go-ness. If you dont need the decks for whatever your doing it's all you need, the inbuilt soundcard is good & loud. Can be easily configured as you need. Oh and it includes traktor pro 2, which is great. I do sound like I should be selling S2's for a living I believe you should make a list of the kit your most interested in and go to a store and have a test of it. Nothing worse than getting somethiing you dont like |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 | Sorry to keep bumping this thread, but the advice has been really helpful so far and I believe I'm finally getting closer to choosing a controller. I like the sound of Jiggle's set up, using an S2 with an additional soundcard. But after believeing about it, I'm wondering if there's any point in getting a controller with a built in soundcard if I'm going to be using an external SC. Should I just get something like the VCI-100 instead? Then link that up with an Audio 8 with the turntables plugged in? Or is there another good reason to get the S2? |
| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 | Haha, sorry misunderstood. Yeah I don't mind mapping the midi how I want it, but would prefer if it was all done perfectly out of the box. It sounds like the XD with Itch does a pretty impressive job of that, another thing that appeals about that set up. I've read very good things about these elastic beat grids, maybe one day I'll get round to working that stuff out but like I say for now I'm happy to beat match myself |
| Barton Rigazio 01.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by Nibbsy
I do take the time though to beat-grid most of my tracks. It's really simple in Itch and I actually believe the elastic gridding in Itch is much better than the beat-gridding in Traktor. Most ppl are used to Traktor already though so it's no biggie for them. Just wanted to clarify! Itch rocks woot! |
| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by Jiggle
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| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 | GI Trackt, that's really helpful, thanks. It sounds like I'm in the same position you were when you got the XD. From what you say it sounds like a great piece of kit, and like you I'm not too attached to Traktor - like you say I don't use most of the advanced features so wouldn't miss much by switching. The lack of pitch sliders and small jog wheels are quite a problem for me though - I still like to do my own beat matching sometimes and believe I'd struggle with rotary controls. Like you say, I don't have time to go through mapping my tracks which don't get auto gridded properly, I'd rather just beat match them myself while mixing. I'm definitely not concerned about switching to Itch, there's a lot about it that really appeals to me, particularly some of the library management features. |
| Jarod Perrodin 01.11.2011 | it routes all the sound through the audio 8, 2 inputs from the decks which I used as decks C & D, and the output through any out you like on the audio 8. Traktor will use the s2 as a controller and not use its soundcard. You can only use 1 soundcard at a time in traktor, you can set up an aggregate device for 2 soundcards, but with the audio 8 ive never had to. You got it right, I use the s2 with the decks as 2 live inputs on C & D. The crossfader is assignable so you can put whatever decks you like on either side. You can map the s2 to use the eq's & everything else on each deck aswell. I use the deck reset switch to flick each side from a - c, b - d Sorry my posts dont always make sense |
| Barton Rigazio 01.11.2011 | Hey man totally understand your frustration in finding the perfect controller! I'll give you my story. I started on Traktor, was still learning the ropes and using the most basic features just like you. Heard great things about the DX and also Itch 2.0 had just come out. Saw a great deal on the DX and thought I'd give the hardware and software a try. To be honest, switching to Itch was very frustrating at first. You get used to doing everything a certain way with Traktor. Long story short, I stuck with it and absolutely love Itch now. I'm pretty sure that I will only be using Itch controllers from now on and won't be going back to Traktor any time soon. Itch has the basics and bare essentials and I like it that way. Other people are much more creative with the FX/mixing/mappings of Traktor and that's cool too. I never got to the advanced level of Traktor where I could take advantage of Traktor's possibilities. I believe this is one the reasons it was easier for me to make the switch to Itch, I never felt tied down to Traktor. Ever since I switched to Itch, I've been absolutely loving it. To be honest, it feels more professional to me than Traktor does. The only gripe I have is that the quantize/snap features of Itch (which are built in) are not as strong as Traktor. Besides that, I find absolutely no faults. Itch is also not mappable but I find this to be a plus. I dont have the time to make my own mappings. I just need a simple controller with EQ's so I can make my podcasts. As far as the DX, it's a wonderful piece of gear. Again, this is only because it fit MY needs. Other people may not agree simply bc they have other hardware requirements that need to be met. I needed something... 1) small (DX is still relatively portable haha) 2) no real need for scratching (the small non-touch sensitive jogs are perfect for nudging. Yes the pitch is rotary, but you'll get used to it.) 3) In-built soundcard (I didn't have any beforehand. Plus, less stuff to lug around) The DX was the perfect solution and it's been wonderful. Only now am I possibly considering switching to the VCI-300 (Itch) simply because I believe I want to get into some scratching and also work more on my beat-matching. I'm still hesitating about leaving the DX! I have nothing but positive things to say about Itch and the DX, especially after coming from Traktor. My only advice about Itch is have an open mind with it when you start. It takes a little time getting used to the new user interface. It will be frustrating at first, but keep believing in it and it will win you over! Gluck dude! |
| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 | Thanks Jiggle, that makes some sense. I'm still not clear though on how the Audio 8 works with the S2. Are you basically using 4 decks in Traktor, with the turntables playing 'live' through 2 of the decks? So when you mix between deck A (on the S2) and deck D (right hand turntable), for example, are you not then using 2 sound cards at once? One to route the sound from the turntable, and the other to play from the S2? Is Traktor ok with doing that? |
| Jarod Perrodin 01.11.2011 | Yeah, but to be honest I've only hooked them up to check it all works because someone asked It all works. |
| Kayce Mesia 01.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by Jiggle
Originally Posted by Nibbsy
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| Jarod Perrodin 01.11.2011 | to hook the decks up you'd need another soundcard, the S2 only has outputs. If you have/get another soundcard you can use decks C & D in traktor as live inputs and mix away like normal, s2 as a mixer, and still have the s2 decks like normal. The timecode setup requires traktor scratch, the s2 & s4 come with traktor pro so its something you have to pay more for to get timecode control. Same with the traktor Scratch certified mixers I believe. It depends what you want to do with the timecode? Scratching on the jog wheels is exactly like my 1210's, just smaller and no jumps the audio 4/8 or traktor 6/10 are all traktor scratch ready. You can pick up second hand audio 8's But you would need the scratch pro upgrade for timecode. |
| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by Jiggle
How do you record with the S2? Presumably I'd need to have an Audio 6/8 so I can plug the turntables in to record? Are you sure it works with 2 turntables? I can't understand how you can have both connected when there aren't 2 inputs on the S2. Do you (or anyone) know if that setup would work with timecoded vinyl? Surely you would need 2 line inputs, one for each turntable going in to each channel on the S2? Or have I misunderstood? Sorry for all the questions, I'm just struggling to work out how it all fits together. Any help you can give would be much appreciated. |
| Bertha Fathy 01.11.2011 | I thought I'd like a Twitch as well...Turns out I didn't. lol Who would have thunk. Cool controller, but The S2/S4 is just miles ahead. |
| Jarod Perrodin 01.11.2011 | Get the s2 and a sound card. I've got the s2 and an audio 8, 2 x 1210's which are just getting dusty. I used to love beat juggling, vinyl all the way. But Im so happy with the s2. The jog wheels are awesome. You can always record the vinyl and use it on the s2 without any extra hardware. Thats my biased advice anyways. Have you been to a store and checked any of the kit out yourself? I went out to get a twitch and came home with the s2 and it will fit on your desk |
| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 | To be honest i don't believe I've ever pre-cued a track before loading it onto a deck in Traktor. I generally pick the track, load it onto the deck, then start cueing in my headphones. So that's not a huge issue for me. I've looked again at my set up, and it really won't be easy to fit an S4 between my turntables on my desk. It's 20 inches wide, which seems such an unnecessary size. Apart from anything the turntables would be really far apart compared to a standard mixer. I'm still hoping that someone can suggest another controller that would suit my needs, but I'm starting to become less optimistic that there's one out there :/ |
| Bertha Fathy 01.11.2011 | My biggest beef with Itch was that I couldn't pre-cue a track before loading it onto a deck. Maybe I was just dumb and unable to figure it out, but I tried and tried...I prefer to do that since I would go through and pick a song that would mix well with what was currently playing on the other deck. One thing that Traktor does that Itch didn't was quantize/cue point juggle sync (again, maybe it did, but I couldn't figure it out in my limited time with it). That's where you can argue the lack of need for the S4 + Traktor. But if that's not your thing, the functionality is still HUGE for what it all does. |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by nicoga3000
Regards software, I am genuinely unfussed about switching. I use so few of the advanced features in Traktor (never loop, never manually beatgrid etc) that I can't imagine I'd really feel the difference that much - I use it as a means to put a track on the deck, beatmatch/sync it, then it's just EQ's, volume and crossfading. Is Itch really that different for those functions? |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 | Thanks very much Gre3nergy, that's all very interesting. I wouldn't say that I want to scratch, it's more that I like to be able to turn a platter to scroll through the track, do spinbacks etc. It's not a deal breaker by any means, I'd just prefer to have it than not. Same with pitch sliders - like you, often when I'm mixing digitally I won't touch the pitch sliders as I'm using sync, but I'd prefer them to be there than not. It does slightly put me off that A&H have already discontinued it and dropped the price though. That's pretty rare for A&H DJ gear in my experience. I'm not sure I'd have no regrets about an S4, as I do have reservations. The build quality and presence of the XD sounds somehow more substantial than the S4, which gives the impression of being a bit plasticky. It's also much bigger than I'd like, and seems to be more aimed at looping/sample decks than straight up mixing. In terms of straight mixing the XD sounds like it's better. It's just a shame about the other limitations. Thanks again for your help. |
| Bertha Fathy 02.11.2011 | The S4 offers MUCH more than just a glorified loop controller, I promise! The built-in sound card is awesome, the absolute GORGEOUS integration with Traktor, and the super quality is impossible to complain about. That being said, while the S4 does have awesome power of sample decks and loop controls, it is perfectly capable of being used as a 2-deck mixer (which is primarily what I've used it for), or a 4-deck mixer (for all those capable of wrapping their head's around that...I can't!). My one comment that I will make regarding Gre3nergy's post, is that you'll want to try out both pieces of software before making the jump. I used Traktor with an S4, tried Itch with a Twitch, and I'm back to Traktor. Itch isn't BAD, but once you get used to one, it's very difficult to fully appreciate what the other offers. Anyways, I still stand by my statement that you won't be disappointed if you burn cash on the S4 - the unit is simply one of the coolest pieces of hardware I've EVER purchased for any reason. |
| Arnette Schmieg 02.11.2011 | hey! i definitely get what you and others mean when you say that it's appealing to pull something out of a box and have it work! i would not exclude the idea of making a switch to Itch 2.0 since you are coming from a vinyl background. addressing ur questions! 1) from my personal use, thus far, i feel that the jog wheels "don't feel cheap". in itch, i use it to nudge my tracks into timing but that's about it. i don't do anything more complex like scratching...something it sounds like you are interested in. (once again, S4 has this capability) 2) There isnt a pitch slider on the DX. this is a huge disadvantage, even for a person like me who dosent come from a vinyl background...We are DJ'S! and if you are serious/passionate about what you do, learn the basics of what you are doing...AKA beat matching and tempo sliding ur tracks!!! you are right, this is a feature that i wish they didnt change. the twist knob is "somewhat effective" but once again, you dont have the ease/feeling of a slider! 3) yes, it seems to be that the DX may be discontinued. Im not sure why they discontinued this item, but when this controller was first released, it ran something like 1500! that's WAY too much and probably had to do something with it. looking hind-sight, i most definitely jumped the gun purchasing the xone dx, but ultimately, a controller is a controller...if you got MAD SKILLZ, you can rip mixes on anything!!!! (besides, it was REALLY sad DJing with a keyboard for many many years...) after all, it still is a controller that is fully mappable, thats got to be good for something! personally, im waiting for the mixing software called "the one". its a fully customizable UI! overall, it sounds to me like you want the S4 over the DX. i would save and make an investment that you have absolutely no regrets/questions about! my thoughts... i love my DX but looking back, should have probably waited for the S4. i would like to eventually learn how to scratch and all that...so i have to overcome another hurdle before i make that switch... one that you may avoid by purchasing the S4! hope this helps!! |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 |
Originally Posted by nicoga3000
I'm just amazed there isn't an alternative. When I started considering an upgrade I thought I'd be spoilt for choice, with an array of options that would all do what I want. The more I look into it, the more it's looking like the S4 (and possibly the MC6000) is the only one that does what I need. I'm still researching though, and still holding out hope that someone is going to come up with another alternative. The S4 just seems a bit too focussed on things like looping and sample decks, which I really have no use for, and is bit too big for my set up. |
| Bertha Fathy 02.11.2011 | I'll reiterate what a few people have said - save a little more and get an S4. No really, do it. You'll be happy you did. |
| Noma Micu 02.11.2011 | Thanks Gre3nergy, that's really helpful. Interesting to hear from someone who has made the TP2 to Itch switch. I'm not too attached to TP2 so not averse to making the switch. In fact there are a few things (smart crates, for one) which I am keen to switch for. To be honest one of the things about the XD that appeals is the lack of customizable mapping. I mean, I'm all for freedom and customization, but I'm also a big fan of stuff that 'just works' out of the box, so that you don't feel like anything need changing. Obviously that wasn't the case for you though, and no doubt I would also find things I'd like to tweak. 2 things that are putting me off the XD - the jog wheels sound quite poor, and there are no pitch sliders (it has twist knobs instead, right?). How did you find these 2 aspects? It sounds like those 2 things make it more removed from old style vinyl mixing than other controllers. Are you finding this? It also looks like the XD may have been discontinued, and the price has dropped a lot since release. Is this the case and why? The fact that it doesn't support DVS is very disappointing, I was under the impression that it did. |
| Kayce Mesia 01.11.2011 | Thanks for sharing your experience, Gre3nergy. I'm curious about the Xone mixers/controllers, specifically the DB4 and 4D. Can they support timecoded vinyl/CDs? |
| Arnette Schmieg 01.11.2011 | Hey! So i just recently bought the xone dx and made the switch from TP2 to Itch 2.0.1. First off, the xone dx is completely midi mappable with TP2. Im currently tweaking a midi mapping that i got from traktor bible 2. their also is another link within DJTT under the thread of something called like "all midi mapping list" or something like that...if you do decide to buy a xone dx, this would be a good place to start! Also, speaking from personal experience, Itch 2.0 is NOTHING like TP2. everything is locked up, and you cant "map/change" anything within the program...im still giving Itch 2.0 a shot for now....but honestly, this program is UTTER SHIT! it is extremly frustrating to go from a UI where i can change and controll everything to a UI that is completly locked up! also, the xone dx is not a stand alone mixer. So if you want traktor scratch, you need another sound card I.E. the traktor audio 6, 8, 10 box. this ultimately means that your soundcard in the xone dx will goto waste. from the sounds of it, you either want a xone 4d or the traktor s4, since you want dvs control. on a side note, the one thing that i will have to complain about the DX mapping with traktor is that you cant "roll" the cue points like with an s4 controller or even a keyboard. what i mean by this is, if i hit the "1" button that is set to cue point #1, i cant press it repeatedly to make 1/8, 1/4, 1/2 notes etc....this is annoying but other than that, so far so good with the xone dx and traktor! hope this helps!! |
| Noma Micu 01.11.2011 | Ok, thanks. To be honest the X1 doesn't appeal to me for use as a deck - no jog wheel or pitch slider just take it a bit too far away from a traditional turntable for me. Obviously I've never used one so can't be sure, but that's the impression I get. I'd also prefer to move away from using an analogue mixer, so that I would still have an all in one set up without having to have additional midi controllers or turntables. I'm leaning towards the Xone XD at the moment. I would be very grateful if someone could confirm the following: - It will work as a stand alone mixer and midi controller for Serato - It will work as an analogue mixer for 2 external turntables (although only via the software, as I understand it, so not a 'true' analogue mixer) - It will work with timecoded vinyl, without any additional pieces of gear - All of the above are fully interchangeable, so that it's possible to, for example, play an MP3 on deck A in midi controller mode, mix into another MP3 on deck B using a timecoded vinyl, then mix back to an analogue vinyl playing 'direct through' on Deck A Also, are there any other controllers that can do this? It sounds like the S4 does, but any others that are a bit cheaper and a bit smaller than the S4? Denon MC6000? Numark NS6? Thanks all for all your help with this. |
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