REKORDBOX 2.01 Now with Key Detection!
REKORDBOX 2.01 Now with Key Detection! Posted on: 10.09.2012 by Nita Eviston Hey guys,whether or not you use cdjs, rekordbox is free and 2.01 now detects track key! Did i mention its free? http://rekordbox.com/download/download.php?lang=en interested in seeing some that also use MixedInKey compare results to see how accurate it is | |
| Libby Mudie 24.10.2012 |
Originally Posted by Morgraw
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| Oren Arizola 13.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by robdquick
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| Shonda Soulier 13.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by fullenglishpint
camelotHarmonicMixing.jpg 8A = Am...if Rekordbox analyzes Am as the key, you can continue to use the wheel as a reference. |
| Tatum Ansaldo 24.10.2012 | I'm not sure if rekordbox stores key data in metadata or in its own separate settings file. |
| Libby Mudie 24.10.2012 |
Originally Posted by Morgraw
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| Dania Harmonson 30.09.2012 | quick question: how can I update my traktor library after I analyzed the track in rekordbox? the Key doesn't appear! maybe the tracks must be unlocked? |
| Tatum Ansaldo 14.09.2012 | I believe you're really putting far too much emphasis on keys. If it doesn't fit, you can hear that in your headphones. As you said, when something is flat out wrong it's easy to tell. If it's not flat out wrong, you can make the mix work. Even if it is flat out wrong, you might be able to use a sparse section or loop without melody. Also, a given algorithm might be much more accurate with certain genres or styles. 30 songs isn't enough to accurately gauge that. |
| Graciela Helweg 14.09.2012 | I believe what you're describing is the trade-off that you make when deciding to either key your tracks yourself or let some other program do it for you. Doing it yourself is going to give you the most accuracy, but will likely take much more of your time than running them through a key detection program. If you can cope with less than perfect accuracy of your keys then it's a very useful tool and will save you a lot of time. I agree the blurb on the MIK website about "virtually guarantees" and "100% harmonic" can give the impression that it hardly ever gets the key wrong, but it's not saying anything technically wrong. The key of a track is subjective, two people can disagree about the key and both be right. Most of time the key is pretty clear cut, but sometimes it can come down to a choice of two keys and some people perceive the track to be in one key rather than the other, without there being an actual key change in the track. |
| Malissa Mountcastle 14.09.2012 | I dunno, i would say that 30 is enough to give you a representation of it's accuracy. If i did 300 you would only expect to see that number multiplied ten fold... I guess there is some bias in my opinion because i feel like MIK takes people for a bit of a ride by exaggerating the capability of their software, and also by their practise of forcing users to be online to use their software. I know from my experience that were I a user of it, I could believe of a number of times where that would have screwed me over... In this particular case, I believe being wrong to a relative degree and being totally inaccurate hold different pitfalls. What's messed up about the way that MIK is wrong is that if say, you have something in 4A and it labels it 5A, then you are never going to pull out a truly harmonically balanced mix unless you go 5A->4A. So every time you mix 5A->5A with that track, then you're pulling out a mix which could still be pretty tenuous. Just because something is a 5th up doesn't mean the mix wouldn't sound ropey as hell, it just means that its the best chance you have of modulating from one key to another. Added to that if you try to go 5A->6A when in reality it's 4A->6A then that is most likely going to sound like a total train wreck. Now lets say you have the 5A (really a 4A) and mix it with another incorrectly labelled track, this time a 6A which is really a 7A. Now, the user believes they are going from 5A->6A, but in reality they are moving 4A->7A. Long story short, if you have inconsistencies in the labeling even to this relative degree, if those are all over your library, then the system pretty much falls apart. At the very least, it's hard to put your trust in it... When something is flat out wrong it's easy to tell. If i was using key detection software, I would rather the mistakes be obvious when they are there, but the rest of the time be able to trust as much as is possible that the software is giving you the correct answer. That's why i believe that Rekordbox will probably steer people who want this kind of function in a better direction, rather than MIK which uses an over inflated opinion of its-self to give DJ's a pretty false sense of confidence in the matter. Also, if two people come up with two different answers as to the key of a track, then either one of them is wrong, both of them are wrong or the track changes key somewhere... |
| Graciela Helweg 14.09.2012 | No key detection algorithm is 100% accurate (even different people will key the same track differently) so you can pick a small selection of tracks and it will appear that one is much better than the other. I don't believe trying 30 tracks is really enough of a trial to say if MIK is better or worse than Rekordbox. Also you seem to say that MIK got keys wrong to a relative degree whereas Rekordbox got it totally wrong, do you really mean that RekordBox is better than MIK? Being slightly out is surely better than being completely out, no? |
| Malissa Mountcastle 14.09.2012 | I had a look at this out of curiosity as to how accurate the key detection was. I actually thought it worked better than MIK. I analysed about 30 tracks and it got 3 or 4 wrong. The difference i found though was that where as mixed in key will be wrong to a relative degree (ie: it might identify a 5A track as a 6A because there could be a predominant part of the music with a G as opposed to a C) the ones that were incorrect in Rekordbox were just flat out wrong. I'm not sure why so many people rave about mixed in key. I personally believe their system is a bit of a pisstake. It's such an inconvenience for users to have to be online to have their tracks analysed. What if you're on a plane on the way to a gig or in the middle of Backwater, Nowhere without internet access doing some prep work? They're so precious about other people getting at their 'Special Algorithm' for detection. They would probably have more reason to be so protective if mixed in key didn't give incorrect results half the time (albeit to a relative degree). Added to which their 'revolutionary' Camelot wheel is just a theoretic principal which has been around for eons (though credit to them, looking down a list of numbers is easier at speed than a list of letters with Flats and Sharps) Bottom line, i believe Rekordbox does a better overall job if you want key analysis. If i didn't do it by ear, i would want a program that got it totally wrong 10% of the time over a program which made practical use difficult as well as constantly half assed results... |
| Oren Arizola 13.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by robdquick
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| Freida Leash 13.09.2012 | i'm hoping this gives more stability to the program, but after reading am unsure. for something that is supposed to be the computer side of your $6k rig, it sure does seem flaky. |
| Tatum Ansaldo 13.09.2012 | Well yes, but learning it is going to be easier in the long run. I guess putting it in front of you while playing for a while would help you do that. |
| Shonda Soulier 13.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by fullenglishpint
camelotHarmonicMixing.jpg 8A = Am...if Rekordbox analyzes Am as the key, you can continue to use the wheel as a reference. |
| Tatum Ansaldo 13.09.2012 | And yes, it takes a little longer to learn the circle of fifths, but once you have it works just the same. |
| Tatum Ansaldo 13.09.2012 | I'm pretty sure the Camelot system is exclusive to MIK, anyone else wanting to use it has to licence it from them. That makes it illegal for other programs to label keys with Camelot notation unless they're licenced, and since rekordbox is free and available to anyone it would seriously undercut MIK profits if they licenced it. |
| Shonda Soulier 13.09.2012 | The Camelot wheel gives you the key name too. I don't understand how this is a legitimate gripe. |
| Random X 13.09.2012 | Cool! Thanks for the tip! |
| Tatum Ansaldo 13.09.2012 | Man that sucks. Rekordbox creates a backup settings file with all your playlist info every time you quit. On OSX it's in Library > Pioneer > Rekordbox. You'll find datafile.edb and datafile.backup.edb. When I'm analysing and making playlists I periodically quit, which updates both. If you get a crash, rename the corrupted datafile.edb as datafile.edb.old and the backup file as the new datafile.edb. Open rekordbox and everything should be as it was last time you quit. |
| Random X 13.09.2012 | Oof.. Just when I was compiling a killer tracklist for a new recording... |
| Tatum Ansaldo 13.09.2012 | I'm getting crashes with certain files, and having to use a backup settings file in the library to start it again. Rekordbox seems to be OK overall, but it has some serious issues. Once it crashes, it resumes its task on restart... Making it crash again. If you select a load of files to relocate, it offers you finder windows sequentially for each file individually with no option to cancel. You accidentally tried to relocate 200 files? You either force quit or click cancel 200 times. |
| Random X 13.09.2012 | Hmmmm... It crashed... |
| Cassie Sangermano 13.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by and_leite
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| Lanette Heinitz 12.09.2012 | how accurate is this key detection and is it good as Mixed In Key 5.0? |
| Oren Arizola 11.09.2012 | For those who for whatever reason still want the Camelot key and are running Windows, you can use MP3Tag to export the keys to a file, replace it and then import it back. It’s a very handy application. I am not sure, but must exist something similar for Mac users |
| Ashanti Andreacchio 11.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by Lilac
I don't see how it could be any more interesting mix opertunities.you still be mixing by the same prinsibles even if it's Cm or 5A mixing in key wan't change because of the way you name the cords. 10 can als be 0a and 10 + 10 will always be 20 or 14 ( witch actualy is 20) |
| Ossie Pooley 11.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by tekki
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| Peggy Gabrielson 11.09.2012 | I believe this is the first time rekordbox has one-upped traktor on anything...yay. Hopefully it has that traffic light thingie built in too? |
| Celine Surico 11.09.2012 | Is the key info saved back to Id3 tags in Rekordbox? |
| Alla Bluemke 11.09.2012 | I'm sure there is a user field to can enter into. Maybe the best bet is to have pio create the keys then somehow export to excel and change to camelot? I don't know if there is really an easy to to convert it. Probably better off just learning the keys, and what works, good chance to get knowledgable with music anyways! |
| Random X 11.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by Audeo
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| Maribeth Tidler 11.09.2012 | Is there an easy way to convert to Camelot keys? If the key is wrote to the key field couldn't you go through in a batch sort of thing and add it to the comments field? I might be talking out of my ass here.... Also thanks for the tips - got the key detection working! |
| Venetta Cawyer 11.09.2012 | The only gripe is that it isn't in Camelot keys But thus far, a great extra and free feature! |
| Tatum Ansaldo 11.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by Lilac
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| Ciara Cuttill 11.09.2012 | dude thanks for this ... been wanting to mess with rekordbox and now I can get off my lazy bum and start regridding my tracks |
| Tatum Ansaldo 11.09.2012 | You need to turn on key analysis in preferences and make sure you have the key column active in the browser. |
| Maribeth Tidler 11.09.2012 | Well I tried it on a couple of tracks and it didn't do anything or am I missing something? |
| Rolanda Clodfelder 11.09.2012 | Mobile app was updated too.. Get it while its hot. |
| Ossie Pooley 11.09.2012 | How are you guys finding the key detection? Is it accurate? |
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