Key Change + Echo Freeze

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Key Change + Echo Freeze
Posted on: 03.10.2012 by Marti Virkler
So two fairly unrelated questions but both involve mapping.

First off, is mapping key changing the same as using the transpose stretch effect (it would be much easier to set up that effect than it would be to change the key mapping). I ask primarily because I would have to create a setup where on pressing down the jogwheel the key instantly resets to 0 whereas I could just do that by toggling the effect off using my S4.

Second, the echo freeze technique is great... but I want to know what parameter I have to tweak to keep that echo going? Is there any way to complete kill its decay, I hate how short the echo lasts and just want it to stick around longer!

Thanks for any input!

Dave
Marti Virkler
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by Stewe
If new track is loaded purposely or accidentally it will mess with trail. Using Masher and Delay can be more suited to this operation and can prevent audio pop-ups.
I'll make sure to look into this, it's actually much easier to catch vocals with the masher for some reason. Seems like the echo effect will grab what will delay a few ms after you hit the feedback button. The masher is pretty instantaneous so as a whole the vocals sound a bit better with the masher... I just want to make sure I can get that "echo" sound just right.
Kellie Myrum
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by jayo
Isn't that exactly what the OP is asking for, for the echo to trail for a prolonged period?
If new track is loaded purposely or accidentally it will mess with trail. Using Masher and Delay can be more suited to this operation and can prevent audio pop-ups.
Evie Baghdasarian
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by Stewe
That will leave a trail even when song is stopped and when you load another one it will double up the volume of echo trail. Why not just use beatmasher to grab some sample and make fade out by deck volume?

What do you want to use it for?
Isn't that exactly what the OP is asking for, for the echo to trail for a prolonged period?
Kellie Myrum
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by jayo
Take the filter out of the echo freeze, should prolong the effect.
That will leave a trail even when song is stopped and when you load another one it will double up the volume of echo trail. Why not just use beatmasher to grab some sample and make fade out by deck volume?

What do you want to use it for?
Marti Virkler
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by Stewe
1 It isn't.

2. More amount of dry/wet and feedback (parameter 2).

So i went ahead and found that with a bit of tweaking, the transpose effect sounds identical to using a key change... just have to make sure you start the effect at 50% as well as have your dry wet at 50%... going to do a bit more testing to verify.

Second, I played with the feedback parameter but it didn't increase the length, just made it sound a bit louder. However playing with the filter made it stick around... Anybody mind linking to an explanation of the delay effect and its parameter? REally curious to understand, thought for sure the filter would just be cutting out some of the high end on the echo but i guess I was wrong?

Thanks!
Marti Virkler
03.10.2012		So two fairly unrelated questions but both involve mapping.

First off, is mapping key changing the same as using the transpose stretch effect (it would be much easier to set up that effect than it would be to change the key mapping). I ask primarily because I would have to create a setup where on pressing down the jogwheel the key instantly resets to 0 whereas I could just do that by toggling the effect off using my S4.

Second, the echo freeze technique is great... but I want to know what parameter I have to tweak to keep that echo going? Is there any way to complete kill its decay, I hate how short the echo lasts and just want it to stick around longer!

Thanks for any input!

Dave
Marti Virkler
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by Stewe
If new track is loaded purposely or accidentally it will mess with trail. Using Masher and Delay can be more suited to this operation and can prevent audio pop-ups.
I'll make sure to look into this, it's actually much easier to catch vocals with the masher for some reason. Seems like the echo effect will grab what will delay a few ms after you hit the feedback button. The masher is pretty instantaneous so as a whole the vocals sound a bit better with the masher... I just want to make sure I can get that "echo" sound just right.
Kellie Myrum
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by jayo
Isn't that exactly what the OP is asking for, for the echo to trail for a prolonged period?
If new track is loaded purposely or accidentally it will mess with trail. Using Masher and Delay can be more suited to this operation and can prevent audio pop-ups.
Marti Virkler
04.10.2012		http://www.mixcloud.com/anjunabeats/...s-bipolar-mix/

check out transitions toward the middle of the mix. He starts our very minimal with very few vocals but once vocal tracks start coming in you can see what how he does it. I'll edit it with a specific time when I can listen to it... kind of in class right now ha ha.
Evie Baghdasarian
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by Stewe
That will leave a trail even when song is stopped and when you load another one it will double up the volume of echo trail. Why not just use beatmasher to grab some sample and make fade out by deck volume?

What do you want to use it for?
Isn't that exactly what the OP is asking for, for the echo to trail for a prolonged period?
Kellie Myrum
04.10.2012		If you can share that mix and time when he does that transition you have mentioned I could look into it. You are right to say that beatmasher doesn't give that echo characteristics but be be creative, you can map some delay at same button with masher and mess with parameters till you got something similar.
Marti Virkler
04.10.2012		So I was big into DJing about 4 months ago (started doing some gigs out, formals, a club twice, etc) but had to take a hiatus over the summer. Over that time got big into a few new things and listened to tons of mixes to try and keep the ideas flowing in my head of what I can do while mixing.

One guy I found on mixcloud is amazing at using what I must assume is an echo out to catch certain parts of vocals from songs and keep them going for a WHILE into the new song ending up with a pretty amazing transition that feels extremely organic. Basically, I want to bring smooth vocal clips into the builds of a new song but keep it around long enough that it won't just fade away in seconds.

I was believeing about your beatsmasher suggestion but the echo out does have the benefit of giving you that echo feel, which a beatsmasher wouldn't inherently do unless you maybe throw in a reverb (? maybe?). I don't mind the echo staying around for quite a while because it wouldn't be hard to just drop the volume on the echo very slowly. I have been messing with delay for a while and have tried a few other methods (loops with reverb, and delay) but can't get the same sound as I do when I just use the advanced delay mode for some reason.

Thanks and let me know!
Kellie Myrum
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by jayo
Take the filter out of the echo freeze, should prolong the effect.
That will leave a trail even when song is stopped and when you load another one it will double up the volume of echo trail. Why not just use beatmasher to grab some sample and make fade out by deck volume?

What do you want to use it for?
Evie Baghdasarian
04.10.2012		Take the filter out of the echo freeze, should prolong the effect.
Kellie Myrum
04.10.2012		Feedback and dry/wet!
Marti Virkler
04.10.2012
Originally Posted by Stewe
1 It isn't.

2. More amount of dry/wet and feedback (parameter 2).

So i went ahead and found that with a bit of tweaking, the transpose effect sounds identical to using a key change... just have to make sure you start the effect at 50% as well as have your dry wet at 50%... going to do a bit more testing to verify.

Second, I played with the feedback parameter but it didn't increase the length, just made it sound a bit louder. However playing with the filter made it stick around... Anybody mind linking to an explanation of the delay effect and its parameter? REally curious to understand, thought for sure the filter would just be cutting out some of the high end on the echo but i guess I was wrong?

Thanks!
Kellie Myrum
04.10.2012		1 It isn't.

2. More amount of dry/wet and feedback (parameter 2).

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