midi controller vs 2 cdj and mixer for a begginer

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midi controller vs 2 cdj and mixer for a begginer
Posted on: 16.09.2012 by Latashia Morone
I have one really basic question for you guys.

My budget is quite limited, and I really don't know what to buy.
I never had any piece of Dj gear before, but I did some mixing on some devices that I borrowed from a friend.

I was considering midi controller from NativeInstruments. In combination with Tractor software can that be solution for me, begging Dj, small town music lover ?

Ty all in advance
Dolke, Serbia
Eloy Kiepke
20.09.2012
Originally Posted by deevey
NO! .. its not a "bad" controller, just overpriced for what you get.

I'd give it a few weeks until the new NI mixer is released and we see the pricing, if its around the $500-600 I reckon paired up with a pair of Sc2000's or PL1's would be the dogs nuts and under $1000 for the lot.

Otherwise I believe that an S4 is more than perfect for what your goals - I just prefer modular if it an option. That or the formentioned Studio4A if you want to save a few $... it looks like it'll be a VERY tasty option Also check out the stanton djc.4 which gets favorable reviews, standalone mixer and under $300.
$500-$600? You're delusional. It's a standalone mixer with a built in scratch-certified sound card, and HID messaging, and it's made by NI, notorious for overpricing. It's based on the Pioneer T1, which cost $1900 when it was released. (some of us know stuff about gear).If this new mixer costs less than $1200 I'll eat my fuckin hat.


Originally Posted by deevey
There is alot to be said for being able to walk into a cramped DJ box and NOT need to play around with cables for 15 mins before a gig.
The MM-1 has a four-port USB hub, and the units are attachable. Meaning you screw them together via the included attachment system, then plug the USBs for the PL-1's into the MM-1. If you're that worried about pluggin in cables, you never have to unplug them. Plus you can even plug your aforementioned Audio 2 DJ into the MM-1. And viola, you only have to plug in the MM1. (I don't believe there would be any added latency on the Audio 2, but if there is.... You have two USBs to plug in.... oh no)

Originally Posted by deevey
We get that you HATE native instruments controllers (among many many others), but 90% of working DJ's do NOT want to re-map their controllers functions, they want it to work out of the box which it does extremely well.
I see you've never opened the controller manager. You also seem to not understand how midi works. 90% of DJ controllers made in the last five years have a stock mapping for traktor that comes in the box. The other 10% require you to google "--XXXXcontroller-- traktor mapping". In either case, you:

1, click preferences
2, big shiny "import" button
3, open the mapping
4, there is no 4.

I've tested this shit, it takes less time than the bullshit "setup wizard" for NI controllers.
Kellie Myrum
18.09.2012
Originally Posted by dolke
what about http://www.numark.com/product/4trak
Nice build quality, much better then Pioneer controllers for sure... You can check Reloop Terminal mix 4 as well. It's also a beast.
Kellie Myrum
18.09.2012
Originally Posted by deevey
We get that you HATE native instruments controllers (among many many others), but 90% of working DJ's do NOT want to re-map their controllers functions, they want it to work out of the box which it does extremely well.
That's one of reasons those DJs sound the same... Other 10% are controllerists who create mappings to give more interesting live sets then just hitting a Sync and mixing two tracks in ordinary way
Rolanda Clodfelder
17.09.2012
Originally Posted by dolke
what do you guys believe of this?

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...J-ERGO+Limited
NO! .. its not a "bad" controller, just overpriced for what you get.

I'd give it a few weeks until the new NI mixer is released and we see the pricing, if its around the $500-600 I reckon paired up with a pair of Sc2000's or PL1's would be the dogs nuts and under $1000 for the lot.

Otherwise I believe that an S4 is more than perfect for what your goals - I just prefer modular if it an option. That or the formentioned Studio4A if you want to save a few $... it looks like it'll be a VERY tasty option Also check out the stanton djc.4 which gets favorable reviews, standalone mixer and under $300.

two PL-1 deck controllers and a MM-1 mixer is $450 plus $100 for the Audio 2 DJ/license is $550. And you get a platform MUCH better than an S4, and $300 cheaper.
There is alot to be said for being able to walk into a cramped DJ box and NOT need to play around with cables for 15 mins before a gig.

We get that you HATE native instruments controllers (among many many others), but 90% of working DJ's do NOT want to re-map their controllers functions, they want it to work out of the box which it does extremely well.
Ngan Shannon
20.09.2012		I'll stick with what I got if I didn't get the controller I have I would of got NI. It seems like a majority big name DJs are shooting for Pioneers which I believe is over killing the price. It the name your putting ur money into, Oh well everyone have their preferrences taste on brand.
You get what you pay for and therefore you make the choice for YOU.
Eloy Kiepke
20.09.2012
Originally Posted by deevey
NO! .. its not a "bad" controller, just overpriced for what you get.

I'd give it a few weeks until the new NI mixer is released and we see the pricing, if its around the $500-600 I reckon paired up with a pair of Sc2000's or PL1's would be the dogs nuts and under $1000 for the lot.

Otherwise I believe that an S4 is more than perfect for what your goals - I just prefer modular if it an option. That or the formentioned Studio4A if you want to save a few $... it looks like it'll be a VERY tasty option Also check out the stanton djc.4 which gets favorable reviews, standalone mixer and under $300.
$500-$600? You're delusional. It's a standalone mixer with a built in scratch-certified sound card, and HID messaging, and it's made by NI, notorious for overpricing. It's based on the Pioneer T1, which cost $1900 when it was released. (some of us know stuff about gear).If this new mixer costs less than $1200 I'll eat my fuckin hat.


Originally Posted by deevey
There is alot to be said for being able to walk into a cramped DJ box and NOT need to play around with cables for 15 mins before a gig.
The MM-1 has a four-port USB hub, and the units are attachable. Meaning you screw them together via the included attachment system, then plug the USBs for the PL-1's into the MM-1. If you're that worried about pluggin in cables, you never have to unplug them. Plus you can even plug your aforementioned Audio 2 DJ into the MM-1. And viola, you only have to plug in the MM1. (I don't believe there would be any added latency on the Audio 2, but if there is.... You have two USBs to plug in.... oh no)

Originally Posted by deevey
We get that you HATE native instruments controllers (among many many others), but 90% of working DJ's do NOT want to re-map their controllers functions, they want it to work out of the box which it does extremely well.
I see you've never opened the controller manager. You also seem to not understand how midi works. 90% of DJ controllers made in the last five years have a stock mapping for traktor that comes in the box. The other 10% require you to google "--XXXXcontroller-- traktor mapping". In either case, you:

1, click preferences
2, big shiny "import" button
3, open the mapping
4, there is no 4.

I've tested this shit, it takes less time than the bullshit "setup wizard" for NI controllers.
Evia Nitch
18.09.2012		If you are determined you want to learn mapping eventually (and it won't take long before you find the out of the box mapping to be not exactly what you want) I'd go for gear that does not have all functions printed on the faceplate. If you remap, you have to ignore it, or put stickers on it.

Xone 1,2,3,4D, Midifighter, K2 etc, etc. all have downloadable maps you can start with. (or have them in the box with overlays)
Kellie Myrum
18.09.2012
Originally Posted by dolke
what about http://www.numark.com/product/4trak
Nice build quality, much better then Pioneer controllers for sure... You can check Reloop Terminal mix 4 as well. It's also a beast.
Latashia Morone
18.09.2012		what about http://www.numark.com/product/4trak
Kellie Myrum
18.09.2012
Originally Posted by deevey
We get that you HATE native instruments controllers (among many many others), but 90% of working DJ's do NOT want to re-map their controllers functions, they want it to work out of the box which it does extremely well.
That's one of reasons those DJs sound the same... Other 10% are controllerists who create mappings to give more interesting live sets then just hitting a Sync and mixing two tracks in ordinary way
Hanna Ridenbaugh
18.09.2012		If I started all over again I would get cdj's and a mixer. You learn the best basics that way and you can just rock up to a cub with a bunch of cd's and lay down a set. You can always add traktor scratch and a kontrol x1 to that later and have a wicked setup.

That's my opinion. I'm fed up trying to setup my gear in a club while the other dj is playing and then worry after about my laptop and gear for the rest of the evening .
Rolanda Clodfelder
17.09.2012
Originally Posted by dolke
what do you guys believe of this?

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...J-ERGO+Limited
NO! .. its not a "bad" controller, just overpriced for what you get.

I'd give it a few weeks until the new NI mixer is released and we see the pricing, if its around the $500-600 I reckon paired up with a pair of Sc2000's or PL1's would be the dogs nuts and under $1000 for the lot.

Otherwise I believe that an S4 is more than perfect for what your goals - I just prefer modular if it an option. That or the formentioned Studio4A if you want to save a few $... it looks like it'll be a VERY tasty option Also check out the stanton djc.4 which gets favorable reviews, standalone mixer and under $300.

two PL-1 deck controllers and a MM-1 mixer is $450 plus $100 for the Audio 2 DJ/license is $550. And you get a platform MUCH better than an S4, and $300 cheaper.
There is alot to be said for being able to walk into a cramped DJ box and NOT need to play around with cables for 15 mins before a gig.

We get that you HATE native instruments controllers (among many many others), but 90% of working DJ's do NOT want to re-map their controllers functions, they want it to work out of the box which it does extremely well.
Latashia Morone
17.09.2012		what do you guys believe of this?

http://www.pioneerelectronics.com/PU...J-ERGO+Limited
Ngan Shannon
18.09.2012		You know I find it interesting that it was pointed out that S2/S4 is not customizable, and trust me you'll want more controlled on you use the controller, mapping isn't so hard to learn. If you can work with computer than you can do mapping.
Checked out traktorbible, since you mention traktor this is what you'll run into: http://www.traktorbible.com/en/kontr...rmappings.aspx
If you get traktor then buy the book it explain everything about mapping better than any other book out there.
Kellie Myrum
17.09.2012		I'll go for Behringer CMD studio 4A - 200+euro. It's all in one unit and it has a lot of controls, nice jogs and 14-bit pitch faders. Also comes with three year guaranty so I consider they build good components with this new series.
Latashia Morone
17.09.2012		Here is the truth guys.

Im quite familiar with the tech, I study automatics and system control, also I believe I'm quite skilled with the pc but have no idea about mapping, and all other stuff regarding digital music. So in other words, I want something to learn. I'm not sure if I want to do it by mapping from scratch and so on... I believe I would rather like to have something that is working great by default and just to improve my skills playing the music. Im sure that one day ill figure that mapping is the thing I would like to learn and maybe switch to some more complex stuff...

I believe my favorite for now are NI S2 and S4 but I'm still open for any suggestion and personal ex of you guys...
As I said, I'm total noob when it comes to djing but at the same time quite skilled with computers, cabling, electronics...

Tnx
Tatum Ansaldo
17.09.2012		If you're worried about stability you might want to look at the serato ITCH controllers. They're also premapped and in my opinion the software is very good. You can't customise the mapping yourself though, which is annoying. I'd say you could do a lot worse than get a vestax VCI-380.
Leeanna Ayla
17.09.2012		S4 or S2 is in no way a waste of money. In fact I would recommend an S4 or S2 to a beginner over anything else because they don't have to worry about mapping anything, just plug it in and go. They don't have to worry about sound cards or setting up the routing correctly in preferences. Sure you can do all this and probably save a little money with other stuff, but they get a better 1 to 1 control with less hassle than anything else out there when going the S4 or S2 route.
Latashia Morone
17.09.2012		I see.

But can you tell me when it comes to quality of manufacturing, many people here told me to stay away of Behringer. I really dont know why is that, are they inferior by design or just lack some finalization (finishing)?

Ty
Eloy Kiepke
16.09.2012		you mean what they call "superior integration", but it's complete bullshit. It's actually just a locked down HID system that you can't remap or customize. Only benefit to it is that you don't have to spend 10 seconds installing a mapping. It's all marketing crap.

Every other controller made by anyone else allows you to remap and customize. Also doesn't need drivers that break every single time they come out with an update.

You'd be better off with any controller besides NI ones, I'm just suggesting the behringer ones lately because they are the best deal I believe I've ever seen in DJ gear.
Latashia Morone
16.09.2012		Tnx for the advises and suggestions mate.

So you believe S2 or S4 from NI would be waist of money comparing with these behringer setup?ractor
What about sync? On the NI showcase videos I saw that one of the best advantages of their S systems is that they are totally in sync with the Tractor software...
Eloy Kiepke
16.09.2012		If you're on a budget, controllers are the way to go. You get more relative quality for your money with controllers than you do with CDJs.

Best you could do is a pair of used 400's or something.

You'd be best served by buying a NON-native instruments controller, and downloading the stock mapping from the manufacturer. If you don't have the means/desire to get traktor without buying it, then buy an Audio 2 DJ from NI, which comes with a license, and get cheap modular controllers.
These both come out next month.

http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/CMD-PL-1.aspx
http://www.behringer.com/EN/Products/CMD-MM-1.aspx

two PL-1 deck controllers and a MM-1 mixer is $450 plus $100 for the Audio 2 DJ/license is $550. And you get a platform MUCH better than an S4, and $300 cheaper.

(there's also the S2 for $50 cheaper, but VASTLY inferior)
Latashia Morone
16.09.2012
Originally Posted by dfinch805
How limited is your budget? And what do you plan to do with your gear?
Hi.

Ty for taking interest in my topic here... I left some details covered and some things unsaid as I wanted to do the during the discussion.

Well, I will use my gear mostly at home but as I progress I will probably make a few gigs at my friends caffe, for close friends, so just small parties.

Im not setting some straight line when it comes to budged, but lets say that It is less than 1000 euros.
Let me just add that I already have decent laptop, notting fancy really but let us say some middle-class machine.
Michell Wehrmeyer
16.09.2012		How limited is your budget? And what do you plan to do with your gear?

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