Dirt Cheap PA Amplifiers

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Dirt Cheap PA Amplifiers
Posted on: 06.08.2013 by Doreen Schurle
Okay so I've just got a new Saturday evening residency at a small venue, and it's PA system is a MESS. They've got an old NSM jukebox (one of the first CD ones, I believe it's a debadged Heritage) and a Blackbox-AV MPA150 amplifier, along with a bunch of Wharfedale Force 2180 speakers.

The setup is one of the most whack ones I've ever seen; 4 or 5 of the speakers are wired up to the jukebox, and another pair are wired up to one channel of the MPA150, and the other channel is driving a single speaker outdoors. It's not exactly the ideal setup, as the NSM keeps (I believe) going into protect mode which also stops it from outputting via RCA to the MPA150. The wiring is all mains cable (yep - wtf?) and there's wires not connected to anything as well.

Basically, it needs a complete re-believe and re-wire. Ideally, I'd like to add another PA amplifier to drive the main speakers and just use the MPA-150 to drive the outdoor speakers. So basically, here are the main questions:

1) Why the hell are modern PA amps rated so much higher than stuff from the 80s/90s? Is it literally just a case of manufacturers playing silly buggers with their rated specs, or are they ACTUALLY higher output?

2) Does anyone know of anywhere - aside from Gumtree and eBay - I can pick up something sub-
Rick Campora
07.08.2013		I picked up a second hand Numark Dimension 3 in a flightcase for
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013
Originally Posted by makar1
1. Obviously technology has progressed so higher ratings are more easily achieved, but as you said there are manufacturers like Behringer who at some point decided to change all their ratings to peak. I would assume that Skytec etc. will do the same as they have no reputation to worry about.
The thing I'm wondering is just how far they've taken this peak nonsense... for example, the Wharfedale Force speakers are rated 100W "programme" aka "peak" aka "music power" etc; but 75W RMS; now, a 33% decrease from the specified wattage isn't too bad for RMS, but if one of these modern amps is 1600W peak and only 250W RMS, that'd give me cause for concern lol.

Originally Posted by makar1
2. I've seen several main-brand home theatre receivers that quote 100W per channel, which go up to 8 channels for 7.1 surround.
I did consider just going down the hi-fi route since they're 8 ohm speakers and you can get - as you said - late 90s AV amps for around
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013		Okay so I've just got a new Saturday evening residency at a small venue, and it's PA system is a MESS. They've got an old NSM jukebox (one of the first CD ones, I believe it's a debadged Heritage) and a Blackbox-AV MPA150 amplifier, along with a bunch of Wharfedale Force 2180 speakers.

The setup is one of the most whack ones I've ever seen; 4 or 5 of the speakers are wired up to the jukebox, and another pair are wired up to one channel of the MPA150, and the other channel is driving a single speaker outdoors. It's not exactly the ideal setup, as the NSM keeps (I believe) going into protect mode which also stops it from outputting via RCA to the MPA150. The wiring is all mains cable (yep - wtf?) and there's wires not connected to anything as well.

Basically, it needs a complete re-believe and re-wire. Ideally, I'd like to add another PA amplifier to drive the main speakers and just use the MPA-150 to drive the outdoor speakers. So basically, here are the main questions:

1) Why the hell are modern PA amps rated so much higher than stuff from the 80s/90s? Is it literally just a case of manufacturers playing silly buggers with their rated specs, or are they ACTUALLY higher output?

2) Does anyone know of anywhere - aside from Gumtree and eBay - I can pick up something sub-
Rick Campora
07.08.2013		I picked up a second hand Numark Dimension 3 in a flightcase for
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013
Originally Posted by makar1
1. Obviously technology has progressed so higher ratings are more easily achieved, but as you said there are manufacturers like Behringer who at some point decided to change all their ratings to peak. I would assume that Skytec etc. will do the same as they have no reputation to worry about.
The thing I'm wondering is just how far they've taken this peak nonsense... for example, the Wharfedale Force speakers are rated 100W "programme" aka "peak" aka "music power" etc; but 75W RMS; now, a 33% decrease from the specified wattage isn't too bad for RMS, but if one of these modern amps is 1600W peak and only 250W RMS, that'd give me cause for concern lol.

Originally Posted by makar1
2. I've seen several main-brand home theatre receivers that quote 100W per channel, which go up to 8 channels for 7.1 surround.
I did consider just going down the hi-fi route since they're 8 ohm speakers and you can get - as you said - late 90s AV amps for around
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013		Okay so I've just got a new Saturday evening residency at a small venue, and it's PA system is a MESS. They've got an old NSM jukebox (one of the first CD ones, I believe it's a debadged Heritage) and a Blackbox-AV MPA150 amplifier, along with a bunch of Wharfedale Force 2180 speakers.

The setup is one of the most whack ones I've ever seen; 4 or 5 of the speakers are wired up to the jukebox, and another pair are wired up to one channel of the MPA150, and the other channel is driving a single speaker outdoors. It's not exactly the ideal setup, as the NSM keeps (I believe) going into protect mode which also stops it from outputting via RCA to the MPA150. The wiring is all mains cable (yep - wtf?) and there's wires not connected to anything as well.

Basically, it needs a complete re-believe and re-wire. Ideally, I'd like to add another PA amplifier to drive the main speakers and just use the MPA-150 to drive the outdoor speakers. So basically, here are the main questions:

1) Why the hell are modern PA amps rated so much higher than stuff from the 80s/90s? Is it literally just a case of manufacturers playing silly buggers with their rated specs, or are they ACTUALLY higher output?

2) Does anyone know of anywhere - aside from Gumtree and eBay - I can pick up something sub-
Rick Campora
07.08.2013		I picked up a second hand Numark Dimension 3 in a flightcase for
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013
Originally Posted by makar1
1. Obviously technology has progressed so higher ratings are more easily achieved, but as you said there are manufacturers like Behringer who at some point decided to change all their ratings to peak. I would assume that Skytec etc. will do the same as they have no reputation to worry about.
The thing I'm wondering is just how far they've taken this peak nonsense... for example, the Wharfedale Force speakers are rated 100W "programme" aka "peak" aka "music power" etc; but 75W RMS; now, a 33% decrease from the specified wattage isn't too bad for RMS, but if one of these modern amps is 1600W peak and only 250W RMS, that'd give me cause for concern lol.

Originally Posted by makar1
2. I've seen several main-brand home theatre receivers that quote 100W per channel, which go up to 8 channels for 7.1 surround.
I did consider just going down the hi-fi route since they're 8 ohm speakers and you can get - as you said - late 90s AV amps for around
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013		Okay so I've just got a new Saturday evening residency at a small venue, and it's PA system is a MESS. They've got an old NSM jukebox (one of the first CD ones, I believe it's a debadged Heritage) and a Blackbox-AV MPA150 amplifier, along with a bunch of Wharfedale Force 2180 speakers.

The setup is one of the most whack ones I've ever seen; 4 or 5 of the speakers are wired up to the jukebox, and another pair are wired up to one channel of the MPA150, and the other channel is driving a single speaker outdoors. It's not exactly the ideal setup, as the NSM keeps (I believe) going into protect mode which also stops it from outputting via RCA to the MPA150. The wiring is all mains cable (yep - wtf?) and there's wires not connected to anything as well.

Basically, it needs a complete re-believe and re-wire. Ideally, I'd like to add another PA amplifier to drive the main speakers and just use the MPA-150 to drive the outdoor speakers. So basically, here are the main questions:

1) Why the hell are modern PA amps rated so much higher than stuff from the 80s/90s? Is it literally just a case of manufacturers playing silly buggers with their rated specs, or are they ACTUALLY higher output?

2) Does anyone know of anywhere - aside from Gumtree and eBay - I can pick up something sub-
Rick Campora
07.08.2013		I picked up a second hand Numark Dimension 3 in a flightcase for
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013
Originally Posted by makar1
1. Obviously technology has progressed so higher ratings are more easily achieved, but as you said there are manufacturers like Behringer who at some point decided to change all their ratings to peak. I would assume that Skytec etc. will do the same as they have no reputation to worry about.
The thing I'm wondering is just how far they've taken this peak nonsense... for example, the Wharfedale Force speakers are rated 100W "programme" aka "peak" aka "music power" etc; but 75W RMS; now, a 33% decrease from the specified wattage isn't too bad for RMS, but if one of these modern amps is 1600W peak and only 250W RMS, that'd give me cause for concern lol.

Originally Posted by makar1
2. I've seen several main-brand home theatre receivers that quote 100W per channel, which go up to 8 channels for 7.1 surround.
I did consider just going down the hi-fi route since they're 8 ohm speakers and you can get - as you said - late 90s AV amps for around
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013		Okay so I've just got a new Saturday evening residency at a small venue, and it's PA system is a MESS. They've got an old NSM jukebox (one of the first CD ones, I believe it's a debadged Heritage) and a Blackbox-AV MPA150 amplifier, along with a bunch of Wharfedale Force 2180 speakers.

The setup is one of the most whack ones I've ever seen; 4 or 5 of the speakers are wired up to the jukebox, and another pair are wired up to one channel of the MPA150, and the other channel is driving a single speaker outdoors. It's not exactly the ideal setup, as the NSM keeps (I believe) going into protect mode which also stops it from outputting via RCA to the MPA150. The wiring is all mains cable (yep - wtf?) and there's wires not connected to anything as well.

Basically, it needs a complete re-believe and re-wire. Ideally, I'd like to add another PA amplifier to drive the main speakers and just use the MPA-150 to drive the outdoor speakers. So basically, here are the main questions:

1) Why the hell are modern PA amps rated so much higher than stuff from the 80s/90s? Is it literally just a case of manufacturers playing silly buggers with their rated specs, or are they ACTUALLY higher output?

2) Does anyone know of anywhere - aside from Gumtree and eBay - I can pick up something sub-
Doreen Schurle
10.09.2013		New amp arrived today after a NIGHTMARE with the first one I ordered (guy promised to deliver then went back on his word and 2 weeks later still haven't got it, so bought another one).

WP_20130910_002.jpg
WP_20130910_005.jpg
WP_20130910_006.jpg


Tested it at home on a pair of Mordaunt Short MS5.30s, and I'm pretty happy with it Not sure if it's really the quoted 900W RMS (bridged), but I suppose I'll find out once I've got it hooked up to the 10 Force 2180s we'll be using.
Rick Campora
07.08.2013		I picked up a second hand Numark Dimension 3 in a flightcase for
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013
Originally Posted by makar1
1. Obviously technology has progressed so higher ratings are more easily achieved, but as you said there are manufacturers like Behringer who at some point decided to change all their ratings to peak. I would assume that Skytec etc. will do the same as they have no reputation to worry about.
The thing I'm wondering is just how far they've taken this peak nonsense... for example, the Wharfedale Force speakers are rated 100W "programme" aka "peak" aka "music power" etc; but 75W RMS; now, a 33% decrease from the specified wattage isn't too bad for RMS, but if one of these modern amps is 1600W peak and only 250W RMS, that'd give me cause for concern lol.

Originally Posted by makar1
2. I've seen several main-brand home theatre receivers that quote 100W per channel, which go up to 8 channels for 7.1 surround.
I did consider just going down the hi-fi route since they're 8 ohm speakers and you can get - as you said - late 90s AV amps for around
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013		Okay so I've just got a new Saturday evening residency at a small venue, and it's PA system is a MESS. They've got an old NSM jukebox (one of the first CD ones, I believe it's a debadged Heritage) and a Blackbox-AV MPA150 amplifier, along with a bunch of Wharfedale Force 2180 speakers.

The setup is one of the most whack ones I've ever seen; 4 or 5 of the speakers are wired up to the jukebox, and another pair are wired up to one channel of the MPA150, and the other channel is driving a single speaker outdoors. It's not exactly the ideal setup, as the NSM keeps (I believe) going into protect mode which also stops it from outputting via RCA to the MPA150. The wiring is all mains cable (yep - wtf?) and there's wires not connected to anything as well.

Basically, it needs a complete re-believe and re-wire. Ideally, I'd like to add another PA amplifier to drive the main speakers and just use the MPA-150 to drive the outdoor speakers. So basically, here are the main questions:

1) Why the hell are modern PA amps rated so much higher than stuff from the 80s/90s? Is it literally just a case of manufacturers playing silly buggers with their rated specs, or are they ACTUALLY higher output?

2) Does anyone know of anywhere - aside from Gumtree and eBay - I can pick up something sub-
Doreen Schurle
10.09.2013		New amp arrived today after a NIGHTMARE with the first one I ordered (guy promised to deliver then went back on his word and 2 weeks later still haven't got it, so bought another one).

WP_20130910_002.jpg
WP_20130910_005.jpg
WP_20130910_006.jpg


Tested it at home on a pair of Mordaunt Short MS5.30s, and I'm pretty happy with it Not sure if it's really the quoted 900W RMS (bridged), but I suppose I'll find out once I've got it hooked up to the 10 Force 2180s we'll be using.
Ninfa Mazariegos
07.08.2013		Marathon amps are good copies of the qsc rmx line. I'm going to get the ma 4050 for sub duty.
Rick Campora
07.08.2013		I picked up a second hand Numark Dimension 3 in a flightcase for
Erica Charvet
06.08.2013		The cheapest amp I could really recommend is the Behringer EP2500. I have four and they have never let me down, and they really do put out good power. Crown XLS, Peavey IPR, and QSC G series amps are also solid budget amps.

Most will run a bit over your price tag though.
Doreen Schurle
06.08.2013
Originally Posted by makar1
1. Obviously technology has progressed so higher ratings are more easily achieved, but as you said there are manufacturers like Behringer who at some point decided to change all their ratings to peak. I would assume that Skytec etc. will do the same as they have no reputation to worry about.
The thing I'm wondering is just how far they've taken this peak nonsense... for example, the Wharfedale Force speakers are rated 100W "programme" aka "peak" aka "music power" etc; but 75W RMS; now, a 33% decrease from the specified wattage isn't too bad for RMS, but if one of these modern amps is 1600W peak and only 250W RMS, that'd give me cause for concern lol.

Originally Posted by makar1
2. I've seen several main-brand home theatre receivers that quote 100W per channel, which go up to 8 channels for 7.1 surround.
I did consider just going down the hi-fi route since they're 8 ohm speakers and you can get - as you said - late 90s AV amps for around
Alphonso Deitchman
06.08.2013		1. Obviously technology has progressed so higher ratings are more easily achieved, but as you said there are manufacturers like Behringer who at some point decided to change all their ratings to peak. I would assume that Skytec etc. will do the same as they have no reputation to worry about.

2. I've seen several main-brand home theatre receivers that quote 100W per channel, which go up to 8 channels for 7.1 surround.

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