Help with x1 mapping - seek knob

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Help with x1 mapping - seek knob
Posted on: 04.11.2011 by Cliff Lohman
Hi,

Im not so great with mapping and was hoping somebody could give me some guidance here..

I basically want to make my x1 seek knob act more like the way it works on the kontrol s4. In other words, the s4 would basically use the value you had set on your loop size as the # of beats that it would seek by.

The x1 mapping seems to be hard coded to jump 4 beats at a time.

The other thing i would love to emulate from the s4 is the way you could basically move an active loop by the amount of beats selected in your loop ( as opposed to trimming the in and out points ).

Anybody know how to do this? Or have a tsi that is setup like this already?

Thnx
Kev
Halley Wurzer
04.06.2012
Alright here is my X1 mapping with the scrub encoder and beat jump buttons going by loop size. I also made it so holding either of the CUP/ABS buttons makes the browse encoders browse and expand/collapse trees. I never use absolute mode or CUP.

DJ SB Kontrol X1.tsi
Halley Wurzer
04.06.2012
Originally Posted by Neolithic
Hey, my s4 is bust so I'm going bac to scratch and an x1, would it be possible for you to post your .tsi file in the mappings section or on this thread? Gave this a shot but believe I'm doing something wrong...

Thanks
+1
Delmer Karcich
30.04.2012
Originally Posted by kevz718
To update everybody:

This morning, photojojo solved my problem. Its as you mentioned Alex - I basically found all my cue/loop move size and set them to "Loop". I suppose you solved my problem too but I missed the reply. So thank u!!

I set it up so that my beatjump buttons and my seek knob both refer to the "Loop" value.

As for moving the loop, I believe I got that working now too:
- SHIFT + turning the loop knob will basically move the whole loop by X amount based on what the loop knob size is set to. Did this the same way as you + jojo recommended for the move/transport knob.


I should note that Im using a custom mapping (but these changes I described above are the only mods I personally made). Otherwise its the 4 deck NHL x1 mapping thats available on NI's site.
Hey, my s4 is bust so I'm going bac to scratch and an x1, would it be possible for you to post your .tsi file in the mappings section or on this thread? Gave this a shot but believe I'm doing something wrong...

Thanks
Cliff Lohman
20.11.2011
Originally Posted by Alex Wild
I just did this recently. If I understand what you're trying to do?
I have my scrub knob (shift+browse i believe) set to scrub by whatever value the loop is set to. I believe I just set the 'Cue/Loop Move Size value to 'Loop' under Button Options. This is by default set to 4 beats but when set to 'loop' will just follow whatever your loop is set to. Havn't found a way to easily move the loop around like on the S4 yet though...
To update everybody:

This morning, photojojo solved my problem. Its as you mentioned Alex - I basically found all my cue/loop move size and set them to "Loop". I suppose you solved my problem too but I missed the reply. So thank u!!

I set it up so that my beatjump buttons and my seek knob both refer to the "Loop" value.

As for moving the loop, I believe I got that working now too:
- SHIFT + turning the loop knob will basically move the whole loop by X amount based on what the loop knob size is set to. Did this the same way as you + jojo recommended for the move/transport knob.


I should note that Im using a custom mapping (but these changes I described above are the only mods I personally made). Otherwise its the 4 deck NHL x1 mapping thats available on NI's site.
Samual Ogura
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by kevz718
Thnx for trying.. ya - I already shorten the value on that control..

I was hoping that there was a modifier that could do pretty much what u said. Im still not up to speed at all on modifiers.. I guess I should start learning about them.

My though was that if there was a modifier that referred to the loop size (like u said) that somehow that could be referenced by the seek knob.
The closest modifier conditions to it are "Is In Active Loop" and "Cue/Loop Move Mode", which are both very close to what you need...
Samual Ogura
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by kevz718
I dont use anything else for loop size control besides the x1..
Unfortunately, I still didn't find a way to make it work consistently...It's more glitchy than not, since you need 2 sets of modifiers (mod values only go up to 7, but there are 10 loop length values). Even if you only chose to use 7 of the values on a regular basis, you'd still have things to reset at every startup of traktor to make sure the modifier and loop state are "in sync". Quite the hassel.
Cliff Lohman
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by DJ_dB
Sorry guys, this is looking more and more like it's not doable (at least not with an encoder). What I've come up with is using buttons that would assign both the cue/loop move size, and loop size to the same value. Problem is, there are other buttons on the X1 that would override that and change the value of either the loop size or the cue/loop move size. :/ This means that putting it on an encoder would simply change the values relative to what it was over-ridden to. You CAN change the size that the seek knob uses by default (it's the Cue/Loop Move Size mapped to Shift.Left.Browse and Shift.Right.Browse...simply change the value that it's directly mapped to.) Also, you can keep the 8count seek that it currently uses, and use beat jump left/right (set to 1 beat by default) for "finer" tuning...

Unfortunately, that's all I can come up with for now, at least until Traktor has "Loop Size Is X" as a modifier condition. But hey, they added a bunch of other cool modifier conditions with pro 2, so who knows.
Thnx for trying.. ya - I already shorten the value on that control..

I was hoping that there was a modifier that could do pretty much what u said. Im still not up to speed at all on modifiers.. I guess I should start learning about them.

My though was that if there was a modifier that referred to the loop size (like u said) that somehow that could be referenced by the seek knob.

Thnx again!
Cliff Lohman
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by DJ_dB
Quick question: Do you use anything besides your X1 to set the loop size (mouse, kb, another controller...)? That would make this impossible. :/ I'm trying to use modifier conditions to mirror the state of the loop size, however, if the loop size is changed by anything but the encoder on the x1, it loses reference. :/
I dont use anything else for loop size control besides the x1..
Samual Ogura
04.11.2011
Originally Posted by racoon
yes he does

i also using the x1 default mapping and are curious about how good we can customize the way how "fine" the seek knob does his job, moving around in a 4 beat grid is pretty "raw"
I'll look into that as well. It may take me a bit, as I've been working with my own custom mapping since the day I got my X1, and I'm not use to the default commands.
Odis Stirewalt
04.11.2011
Originally Posted by DJ_dB
I'm assuming you're using the default mapping right now?
yes he does

i also using the x1 default mapping and are curious about how good we can customize the way how "fine" the seek knob does his job, moving around in a 4 beat grid is pretty "raw"
Cliff Lohman
04.11.2011
Hi,

Im not so great with mapping and was hoping somebody could give me some guidance here..

I basically want to make my x1 seek knob act more like the way it works on the kontrol s4. In other words, the s4 would basically use the value you had set on your loop size as the # of beats that it would seek by.

The x1 mapping seems to be hard coded to jump 4 beats at a time.

The other thing i would love to emulate from the s4 is the way you could basically move an active loop by the amount of beats selected in your loop ( as opposed to trimming the in and out points ).

Anybody know how to do this? Or have a tsi that is setup like this already?

Thnx
Kev
Halley Wurzer
04.06.2012
Alright here is my X1 mapping with the scrub encoder and beat jump buttons going by loop size. I also made it so holding either of the CUP/ABS buttons makes the browse encoders browse and expand/collapse trees. I never use absolute mode or CUP.

DJ SB Kontrol X1.tsi
Leeanna Ayla
04.06.2012
My x1 mapping in the mappings section has this function. You can look at it to see how I did it.
Halley Wurzer
04.06.2012
Originally Posted by Neolithic
Hey, my s4 is bust so I'm going bac to scratch and an x1, would it be possible for you to post your .tsi file in the mappings section or on this thread? Gave this a shot but believe I'm doing something wrong...

Thanks
+1
Delmer Karcich
30.04.2012
Originally Posted by kevz718
To update everybody:

This morning, photojojo solved my problem. Its as you mentioned Alex - I basically found all my cue/loop move size and set them to "Loop". I suppose you solved my problem too but I missed the reply. So thank u!!

I set it up so that my beatjump buttons and my seek knob both refer to the "Loop" value.

As for moving the loop, I believe I got that working now too:
- SHIFT + turning the loop knob will basically move the whole loop by X amount based on what the loop knob size is set to. Did this the same way as you + jojo recommended for the move/transport knob.


I should note that Im using a custom mapping (but these changes I described above are the only mods I personally made). Otherwise its the 4 deck NHL x1 mapping thats available on NI's site.
Hey, my s4 is bust so I'm going bac to scratch and an x1, would it be possible for you to post your .tsi file in the mappings section or on this thread? Gave this a shot but believe I'm doing something wrong...

Thanks
Cliff Lohman
20.11.2011
Originally Posted by Alex Wild
I just did this recently. If I understand what you're trying to do?
I have my scrub knob (shift+browse i believe) set to scrub by whatever value the loop is set to. I believe I just set the 'Cue/Loop Move Size value to 'Loop' under Button Options. This is by default set to 4 beats but when set to 'loop' will just follow whatever your loop is set to. Havn't found a way to easily move the loop around like on the S4 yet though...
To update everybody:

This morning, photojojo solved my problem. Its as you mentioned Alex - I basically found all my cue/loop move size and set them to "Loop". I suppose you solved my problem too but I missed the reply. So thank u!!

I set it up so that my beatjump buttons and my seek knob both refer to the "Loop" value.

As for moving the loop, I believe I got that working now too:
- SHIFT + turning the loop knob will basically move the whole loop by X amount based on what the loop knob size is set to. Did this the same way as you + jojo recommended for the move/transport knob.


I should note that Im using a custom mapping (but these changes I described above are the only mods I personally made). Otherwise its the 4 deck NHL x1 mapping thats available on NI's site.
Kesha Orde
05.11.2011
I just did this recently. If I understand what you're trying to do?
I have my scrub knob (shift+browse i believe) set to scrub by whatever value the loop is set to. I believe I just set the 'Cue/Loop Move Size value to 'Loop' under Button Options. This is by default set to 4 beats but when set to 'loop' will just follow whatever your loop is set to. Havn't found a way to easily move the loop around like on the S4 yet though...
Samual Ogura
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by kevz718
Thnx for trying.. ya - I already shorten the value on that control..

I was hoping that there was a modifier that could do pretty much what u said. Im still not up to speed at all on modifiers.. I guess I should start learning about them.

My though was that if there was a modifier that referred to the loop size (like u said) that somehow that could be referenced by the seek knob.
The closest modifier conditions to it are "Is In Active Loop" and "Cue/Loop Move Mode", which are both very close to what you need...
Samual Ogura
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by kevz718
I dont use anything else for loop size control besides the x1..
Unfortunately, I still didn't find a way to make it work consistently...It's more glitchy than not, since you need 2 sets of modifiers (mod values only go up to 7, but there are 10 loop length values). Even if you only chose to use 7 of the values on a regular basis, you'd still have things to reset at every startup of traktor to make sure the modifier and loop state are "in sync". Quite the hassel.
Cliff Lohman
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by DJ_dB
Sorry guys, this is looking more and more like it's not doable (at least not with an encoder). What I've come up with is using buttons that would assign both the cue/loop move size, and loop size to the same value. Problem is, there are other buttons on the X1 that would override that and change the value of either the loop size or the cue/loop move size. :/ This means that putting it on an encoder would simply change the values relative to what it was over-ridden to. You CAN change the size that the seek knob uses by default (it's the Cue/Loop Move Size mapped to Shift.Left.Browse and Shift.Right.Browse...simply change the value that it's directly mapped to.) Also, you can keep the 8count seek that it currently uses, and use beat jump left/right (set to 1 beat by default) for "finer" tuning...

Unfortunately, that's all I can come up with for now, at least until Traktor has "Loop Size Is X" as a modifier condition. But hey, they added a bunch of other cool modifier conditions with pro 2, so who knows.
Thnx for trying.. ya - I already shorten the value on that control..

I was hoping that there was a modifier that could do pretty much what u said. Im still not up to speed at all on modifiers.. I guess I should start learning about them.

My though was that if there was a modifier that referred to the loop size (like u said) that somehow that could be referenced by the seek knob.

Thnx again!
Cliff Lohman
05.11.2011
Originally Posted by DJ_dB
Quick question: Do you use anything besides your X1 to set the loop size (mouse, kb, another controller...)? That would make this impossible. :/ I'm trying to use modifier conditions to mirror the state of the loop size, however, if the loop size is changed by anything but the encoder on the x1, it loses reference. :/
I dont use anything else for loop size control besides the x1..
Augustina Zulu
04.11.2011
I went down this route a while back. There was a long thread on the NI boards asking if anyone had figured out if it was possible to map a knob to set the scrub resolution. It never went anywhere and I basically figured it wasnt possible.
Samual Ogura
04.11.2011
Sorry guys, this is looking more and more like it's not doable (at least not with an encoder). What I've come up with is using buttons that would assign both the cue/loop move size, and loop size to the same value. Problem is, there are other buttons on the X1 that would override that and change the value of either the loop size or the cue/loop move size. :/ This means that putting it on an encoder would simply change the values relative to what it was over-ridden to. You CAN change the size that the seek knob uses by default (it's the Cue/Loop Move Size mapped to Shift.Left.Browse and Shift.Right.Browse...simply change the value that it's directly mapped to.) Also, you can keep the 8count seek that it currently uses, and use beat jump left/right (set to 1 beat by default) for "finer" tuning...

Unfortunately, that's all I can come up with for now, at least until Traktor has "Loop Size Is X" as a modifier condition. But hey, they added a bunch of other cool modifier conditions with pro 2, so who knows.
Samual Ogura
04.11.2011
Quick question: Do you use anything besides your X1 to set the loop size (mouse, kb, another controller...)? That would make this impossible. :/ I'm trying to use modifier conditions to mirror the state of the loop size, however, if the loop size is changed by anything but the encoder on the x1, it loses reference. :/
Samual Ogura
04.11.2011
UGH. Just bought Xtreme Mapping to make this a breeze (or so I thought)...should've read the ENTIRE review first, as it doesn't work with the X1 in NHL Mode. :/

I'll continue my work, but it may take a little longer.
Cliff Lohman
04.11.2011
Hi,

Yep - using default x1 mapping..

I guess the way the S4 does it is that the seek command always refers to the value that the little LED readout displayed on the s4 unit. That # always corresponded to the loop count.

Im imagining that to make seek work the same way, it would need to refer to the value that the loop is set at. That way, one could use the loop knob to set the length and then the seek would always refer to that #.

Sound possible? Does this sound like the right direction? Ill tinker with it too as I always want to learn more about mapping..

Thnx for the help all!
Samual Ogura
04.11.2011
Originally Posted by racoon
yes he does

i also using the x1 default mapping and are curious about how good we can customize the way how "fine" the seek knob does his job, moving around in a 4 beat grid is pretty "raw"
I'll look into that as well. It may take me a bit, as I've been working with my own custom mapping since the day I got my X1, and I'm not use to the default commands.
Odis Stirewalt
04.11.2011
Originally Posted by DJ_dB
I'm assuming you're using the default mapping right now?
yes he does

i also using the x1 default mapping and are curious about how good we can customize the way how "fine" the seek knob does his job, moving around in a 4 beat grid is pretty "raw"
Samual Ogura
04.11.2011
I don't have an S4 to compare it to, but based on your description, I'll see what I can come up with. I'm assuming you're using the default mapping right now?

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