Beatport track keys vs Mixed in key
Beatport track keys vs Mixed in key Posted on: 23.08.2011 by Jenni Carrasquilla I was messing around and compared 30 tracks between them and 6 matched.Some weren't too bad, MIK would say the track is in A Minor where Beatport would say it's A Major. Just wondering which one you would go by. | |
| Random X 23.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by photojojo
|
| Leeanna Ayla 20.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by tekki
|
| Latoria Kavulich 20.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by tekki
|
| Lashawn Maycock 19.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by sebastiannz
(BTTF, shuffles off, ignores laptop and S4, switches on 1210's and mixes with 12"s and a 2 ch mixer to pay his penance)... |
| Lashawn Maycock 19.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by NewManSoon
Here endeth today's lesson... EDIT: I will add I own MIK4 but tbh I stopped using it, I thought what am I doing?, spending several hours analysing tracks, making notes etc when I could be actually mixing new tracks and seeing how they might fit together, a great deal more fun and interesting I found. I'd spent the previous 16 years DJing without such software and I looked at what value it was adding and I came to the conclucsion, fuck all. That's not to say MIK isn't useful and all power to your elbow if it helps, but me, no thanks, I'll just mix the tracks up during practice sessions and see what happens. |
| Random X 19.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by AtgAni
Ish's Keyfinder is awesome! Loving it. If he would be able to add BPM detection, this would be close to perfection for me. |
| Leeanna Ayla 18.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by amidoinitrite
|
| Random X 23.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by photojojo
|
| Danae Dumler 21.09.2012 | I use MIK because I bought it when they offered unlimited updates, and it keeps getting better. The company's owners are cool guys and very approachable for help on the message board or by email; they even seem to do a nice job of keeping their cool when people are being total dicks to them (which I've seen happen on more than one occasion on that board, esp after their mixing contests). And they freely admit that it's not "accurate" in an absolute sense because key detection is not a science -- they had several musicians come in to check the results of using their algorithms and the musicians couldn't agree on what key various songs were in. It's not arbitrary of course but it can be really subjective. To do your job as a DJ you don't have to know what key a song is in - but it helps if you avoid key clashes no matter what key the song is in. So whether you use MIK or beatport or whatever, stick to the one tool because it's more likely to be consistent within itself. Yes the right way to do that is to listen to your mixes and don't mix songs together that sound like ass -- that's the way I did it for years before I knew shit about key detection and that seemed to work fine for this non-musician (and non-piano-owning) DJ. But the software lets you instantly see some information that will help you decide if two songs might fit together. Just don't rely on it too much - sometimes songs will fit together even if they're not in compatible keys (especially if you mix at points where there's not much going on musically), and sometimes songs with compatible keys will have incompatible rhythms or textures. But having this information gives you a lot more to go on when you're considering mixing two songs you've never mixed before. And for better or for worse - I know some DJs don't like this - it allows you to have a lot more music in your library and make quick decisions among large numbers of songs, some that you know better than others. |
| Audrey Pinda 20.09.2012 | Honestly, I have had a love/hate relationship with MiK. But right now? I'm using it, and loving it. I did have an issue with the company itself for awhile, selling their Mac and Windows licenses separate. But that has been resolved, and I now own and use MiK again. And you know what? It wasn't just a suggestion from these boards. I heard it from a fair few local DJ's in my area, whom I respect. And it was one of those suggestions that made me come back to it again, and see what it really was all about. I bought it at first... awhile ago. Getting my music ready, before I had bought anything to mix with. Just thought it sounded like a solid idea. And then my PC Desktop died (what I was using at the time) and cue basically two years later, and I'm trying it again. And you know what? I find it's a lot of fun to mix utilizing the Camelot Wheel / Harmonic mixing. Yeah, I'm not doing some combinations off the cuff as much as I was before... but my mixes are NOT clashing, and well, maybe I should have the ear for this better naturally, but it works. I also kind of find it fun moving around the circle, picking tracks in that next step that would sound good for the moment. It works really well with the style of mixing I've set up for myself. For a one (or more) hour gig, what I do is pick about 120+ songs, and put them in a playlist. All songs I know well, and all stuff that would work for the evening. Pretty simple really. What I had been doing is going off the cuff with that playlist, going from song to song that I thought would fit well. But I'll admit, I had some key clashing, even though other things lined up. Here comes in MiK. Now, I just organize it by key, and go around the circle to a degree. Sometimes staying on the same key, going to major, back, down for a minute, but it's all pretty simple. I have enough songs that they work well together, and it's building a story with those songs, watching the crowd, and just making it another aspect of my routine. I like it. It does take some thought out of what song I will pick next, by limiting the options that I want to roll with, but it works. I still do everything manually (beatmatching, picking the track to drop off the cuff)... but that limitation is sometimes a strength. And that's what it comes down to. I like my mixes that I've been using MiK with more than the ones I haven't. And in the end? That's really all that matters. If you have time, and want to listen, these are two of my most recent mixes. (I've been spinning breaks almost exclusively lately, but I imagine the principles carry over rather well across the board). Using harmonic mixing: http://soundcloud.com/crb/bear-blasting-breaks Without using harmonic mixing: http://soundcloud.com/crb/bbq-steak-break I like both of the mixes. Honestly I do. I listen back to what I record a lot to figure out where I can improve, if there are any better places I could have mixed tracks in. And I really believe that using Harmonic mixing techniques have improved my mixes. It's tough to put a pin down on it, but that's just how it is. So, I'd highly recommend it to anyone interested. It's not for everyone. You can have great mixes without using it. But I find it an enjoyable system to mess about with, and feel it's honestly improved my mixing. I can't say much more than that, other than try it for yourself. And to the OP: I believe it's best to stick with one program or solution. If it's Beatport, MiK, RE... or just using a keyboard. Just use the same thing across all your tracks, and you should be more than fine. Switching it up is just going to miss out on consistency IMO. |
| Willard Battley 20.09.2012 | I remember I read something about this here is the link : http://blog.dubspot.com/dubspot-lab-...y-vs-beatport/ It is already one year ago but anyway it can still give some clues. |
| Leeanna Ayla 20.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by tekki
|
| Latoria Kavulich 20.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by tekki
|
| Lashawn Maycock 19.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by sebastiannz
(BTTF, shuffles off, ignores laptop and S4, switches on 1210's and mixes with 12"s and a 2 ch mixer to pay his penance)... |
| Evelynn Pennycook 19.09.2012 | Pioneer has Rekordbox which now has key detection - it's free ... haven't tried it though |
| Peggy Gabrielson 19.09.2012 | Thing is, it's more fun mixing when you're not horribly key clashing every mix. |
| Lashawn Maycock 19.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by NewManSoon
Here endeth today's lesson... EDIT: I will add I own MIK4 but tbh I stopped using it, I thought what am I doing?, spending several hours analysing tracks, making notes etc when I could be actually mixing new tracks and seeing how they might fit together, a great deal more fun and interesting I found. I'd spent the previous 16 years DJing without such software and I looked at what value it was adding and I came to the conclucsion, fuck all. That's not to say MIK isn't useful and all power to your elbow if it helps, but me, no thanks, I'll just mix the tracks up during practice sessions and see what happens. |
| Random X 19.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by AtgAni
Ish's Keyfinder is awesome! Loving it. If he would be able to add BPM detection, this would be close to perfection for me. |
| Leeanna Ayla 18.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by amidoinitrite
|
| Werner Bile 18.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by amidoinitrite
Why do so many DJs have the philosophy that the more difficult method is always the better one? |
| Frieda Swoboda 18.09.2012 | Beat port key detection is terrible and even worse it's inconsistent. MIK is far more accurate, but it is also consistent, even when it's wrong. So if you do soley rely on it (which I doubt people do) it will still work nearly every time. For example, you can build a deck with an incorrect tape measure as long as you only use that tape measure. Most amateur (or even pro) DJs won't have a musical ear, so telling them to key it themselves is sort of misleading and unfair. If you've never played an instrument or have a musical background, keying a song is not something you can just pick up learn. A majority of people will never have an ear that is more accurate that MIK. That's not saying that MIK is super accurate, but it means that most people don't have a talent for hearing keys no matter how hard they try. Heck, most DJs can't even tell when something is out of key, let alone key a song. |
| Khadijah Bucker 18.09.2012 | i use this http://www.ibrahimshaath.co.uk/keyfinder/ did 500 songs in it, checked with a keyboard and all of them were right. good enough for me |
| Ashanti Andreacchio 18.09.2012 |
Originally Posted by amidoinitrite
And if it's so easy there should not be any need to bring out a keyboard you should be able to do it by ear right? Just because you don't understand somebelieve does not make it a joke. It is by far easier for not musisians to understand that 12A works with 12B and can go to 1A or 11A insted of saying C#m works with E and can go to F#m or G#m. MIK is totaly worth the money IMO |
| Eugene Stathos 18.09.2012 | There is now a way to search beatport tracks by key, tempo (bpm), and much more. Take a look at http://www.katasonov.com/beatport-key-search |
| Aleta Hartzler 23.08.2011 | MiK ftw |
| Berta Baie 23.08.2011 | hmmm i just assumed Beatport got their keys from the artists as well, guess not, i'll stick with RE for now then as well |
| Temple Guffin 23.08.2011 | bust out a keyboard and do it yourself.. takes about 3-10 seconds a song.. well worth it. put the actual key as well.. I find this whole 10A 8B 35Q to be a complete joke. |
| Deeann Cheron 23.08.2011 |
Originally Posted by Sean_Boy87
|
| Jenni Carrasquilla 23.08.2011 | I wouldn't say it's a waste of money. As bumtsch pointed out, the keys it gives you might not be the right ones 100% of the time, but they will be in compatible keys. |
| Nicola Oatts 23.08.2011 | i just bought mixed in key ... waste of money it is then.. no? |
| Krishna Hospelhorn 23.08.2011 | im guessing that consistency is more likely to yield useful mixes. e.g. a track "10A in mixed in key" is almost always going to mix in well to a "9A, 10A, 11A or 10B in mixed in key". i have no real reason to believe this. but this is the internet, so I might as well just proclaim it as fact. BOO YA. p.s. I use mixed in key a lot and using the camelot system with MIK i haven't had any train wreck clashes in key |
| Delila Vandommelen 23.08.2011 | I used to detect keys with RapidEvolution, back when an article on DJTT put it slightly above MIK in terms of success rate. RE was wrong often enough that it became faster to just fire up RE for its piano w/chords and manually find keys One of the first batches of tracks I purchased off the new beatport was mostly Am/A#m, and that kinda struck me, so obviously I double checked the keys during the usual re-tagging routine. It turned out their analysis wasn't THAT far off - most of these tunes were actually in compatible keys, for instance D#m or Fm instead of A#m. What's more obvious though is the major/minor thing - that seemed to be wrong on most of the tracks (the vast majority of my house/techno is minor) |
| Sammie Filetti 23.08.2011 | Agreed. |
| Rocco Fiveash 23.08.2011 | MIK is FAR from perfect. Grab a keyboard and learn to key by ear. It is not that hard.. I tried doing it for a bit, but realized my mixes were WAY better when I was not relying on a key to put two tracks together. |
| Sammie Filetti 23.08.2011 | MIK has been around for several years, pefecting their algorithm. BP still does not write the key to the mp3 tags, and when asked why, they say it it because they are still working on the algorihythm. (source: beatportal faq if i remember correctly). So trust mik over bp for now, but hopefully bp will become good enough and write them to tags so we dob't need mik. |
| Leeanna Ayla 23.08.2011 | Beatport analyzes them, but I don't know with what. It's also crowd sourced so if they get several reports that one is wrong they'll change it. |
| Candy Vardy 24.08.2011 | Hmm this is interesting as they both come from "reputable places" I'm keen to know who to believe.... |
| Kayce Mesia 23.08.2011 | I'm pretty sure Beatport's keys are specified by the artist. Can't say for sure though because it's been a while. |
<< Back to General DiscussionReply