A question for all the dubstep goers

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A question for all the dubstep goers
Posted on: 05.12.2012 by Donnetta Enrile
Quick question for ya'll. How do you mix a tune thats not harmonically compatible? What is your technique for the butteriest blend? Thanks!
Cole Maroto
06.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
Again, this applies only to transition DJs. If you're actually MIXING, they should always be in compatible keys. Don't knock strict harmonic mixing. It encourages DJs to actually mix, rather than do 64-bit transitions during breakdowns. I Don't care how smooth you get at that, it's crap compared to actual DJing.
i agree

Originally Posted by MyUsername
^Isn't mixing in key better as "just a guideline" ? I mean I have all my records labeled with the key but honestly isn't the general vibe of the song and what music you want to bring for your audience in the limited time that you have just as important ?

Seamless, 10/10 transitions (or mixes if you want to distinguish) are possible, if not common with music in conflicting keys.

Just my
Cole Maroto
06.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
Again, this applies only to transition DJs. If you're actually MIXING, they should always be in compatible keys. Don't knock strict harmonic mixing. It encourages DJs to actually mix, rather than do 64-bit transitions during breakdowns. I Don't care how smooth you get at that, it's crap compared to actual DJing.
i agree

Originally Posted by MyUsername
^Isn't mixing in key better as "just a guideline" ? I mean I have all my records labeled with the key but honestly isn't the general vibe of the song and what music you want to bring for your audience in the limited time that you have just as important ?

Seamless, 10/10 transitions (or mixes if you want to distinguish) are possible, if not common with music in conflicting keys.

Just my
Cole Maroto
06.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
Again, this applies only to transition DJs. If you're actually MIXING, they should always be in compatible keys. Don't knock strict harmonic mixing. It encourages DJs to actually mix, rather than do 64-bit transitions during breakdowns. I Don't care how smooth you get at that, it's crap compared to actual DJing.
i agree

Originally Posted by MyUsername
^Isn't mixing in key better as "just a guideline" ? I mean I have all my records labeled with the key but honestly isn't the general vibe of the song and what music you want to bring for your audience in the limited time that you have just as important ?

Seamless, 10/10 transitions (or mixes if you want to distinguish) are possible, if not common with music in conflicting keys.

Just my
Tatiana Verdeja
06.12.2012
Originally Posted by Bears'N'Backpacks
I understand where Patch is coming from.
This is one of the problems that arises when people learn to DJ this way. Just because your tracks dont have corresponding keys next to them does not mean they are not compatible. Mixing in key is supposed to be used as a guideline to help you plan and control the flow of energy. It is not meant to be some unspoken rule that says your sets must follow a harmonic pattern! They dont. Your set does not need to follow predictable keys just as it does not need to be a specific temp the whole time. Sets are supposed to be dynamic, spontaneous, and engaging. Nit picking details of your sets like this is a major crutch. It narrows your focus down into irrelevant technical aspects when your time would be better spent just playing around with the songs in your set.
Again, this applies only to transition DJs. If you're actually MIXING, they should always be in compatible keys. Don't knock strict harmonic mixing. It encourages DJs to actually mix, rather than do 64-bit transitions during breakdowns. I Don't care how smooth you get at that, it's crap compared to actual DJing.
Lashawn Maycock
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by Patch
There is so much wrong with this thread - I don't know where to start.


Patch, just had a butchers at your SC page, really like the 'Enter the Natural Mystic' track, would slip in nicely on my Rave Breaks/Future Jungle bit on me radio show. Is there a version available to play? Speaking of Nu-Rave, couple of the other DJ's on there are Brizzol based and I'm not too far from there myself. Things are moving forward with the station in the New Year and looking for some additional DJ's/Shows, just wondered if you're interested? Probably ought to take this off line. I'll follow you on SC in sec.

BTTF aka Lofty
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by Patch
There is so much wrong with this thread - I don't know where to start.
What do you find so repulsive? People are just giving advice/opinions on what works.
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by MyUsername
Avid dubstep mixer here.

^I agree with that post.

I find that EQing properly makes loong (over 1 minute of playing together is long IMO) blends a breeze if you choose the right songs. This how I do 95% of my transitions: have all the EQ killed and add and subtract frequencies to your liking.
But I would advise against using this kind of mixing with heavy dubstep with lots of prominent stuff going on or tunes with a lot of vocals, if you got a tune like that on your hands then I say work a quick transition out. Or mix only in the break.
Or if you reach a 16 bar break, start the incoming track at bar 16 instead of bar 1, then you can double drop if you want.

Maybe upload a mix for more directed answers.
Alright. Thanks for all the replys. I'll be uploading a mix sometime today. Thanks again for all the feedback, this site is pretty much the shit!
Tatiana Verdeja
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by Zygote
My bad yo. I should have made my question much more clear. Transitioning is a much better word to use. I'm struggling with "transitioning" during the break down. Lets say track B is playing and it reaches its 16 bar breakdown, and I start playing track A with its 32 bar intro and in hopes of transitioning into track A by time track B has finished its breakdown and has began its build up. Do I bring track A slowly into track B even though it has clashing elements. Eq'ing can only do so much, you know what I mean? Whats your take on something like this?
You just described the absolute bare-minimum of DJing.... Easiest thing you can really do. It's really a thing that just takes learning and feeling out.
My suggestion would be to:

A: Work on track selection, so you're not transitioning between two tracks that don't work together. A lot of new DJs have it in their head that "if a DJ is good enough, they can go between any two tracks" and that's not true at all. A good DJ knows which tracks to play together.

B: work on in/out points, so that you're using the intro of track A, while track B is winding up to go into the breakdown, then you can EQ track B so it's less prominent, without it sounding abrupt, because you've built context with track A.
Matt Kane
05.12.2012
if they
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
Well... Mixing is not synonymous with DJing. Most DJs "transition" but they call it "mixing".
Every Dubstep DJ I've ever heard (and I've heard hundreds more than I'd like) has just transitioned between tracks during breakdowns/buildups, and called that "mixing". Is that what you're talking about, or are you talking about double dropping and mixing actual verses?
My bad yo. I should have made my question much more clear. Transitioning is a much better word to use. I'm struggling with "transitioning" during the break down. Lets say track B is playing and it reaches its 16 bar breakdown, and I start playing track A with its 32 bar intro and in hopes of transitioning into track A by time track B has finished its breakdown and has began its build up. Do I bring track A slowly into track B even though it has clashing elements. Eq'ing can only do so much, you know what I mean? Whats your take on something like this?
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
People actually *mix* dubstep?
What else would it be called? Its not just cut and paste.
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Quick question for ya'll. How do you mix a tune thats not harmonically compatible? What is your technique for the butteriest blend? Thanks!
Cole Maroto
06.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
Again, this applies only to transition DJs. If you're actually MIXING, they should always be in compatible keys. Don't knock strict harmonic mixing. It encourages DJs to actually mix, rather than do 64-bit transitions during breakdowns. I Don't care how smooth you get at that, it's crap compared to actual DJing.
i agree

Originally Posted by MyUsername
^Isn't mixing in key better as "just a guideline" ? I mean I have all my records labeled with the key but honestly isn't the general vibe of the song and what music you want to bring for your audience in the limited time that you have just as important ?

Seamless, 10/10 transitions (or mixes if you want to distinguish) are possible, if not common with music in conflicting keys.

Just my
Nereida Jasnoch
07.12.2012
^Isn't mixing in key better as "just a guideline" ? I mean I have all my records labeled with the key but honestly isn't the general vibe of the song and what music you want to bring for your audience in the limited time that you have just as important ?

Seamless, 10/10 transitions (or mixes if you want to distinguish) are possible, if not common with music in conflicting keys.

Just my €0,02
Tatiana Verdeja
06.12.2012
Originally Posted by Bears'N'Backpacks
I understand where Patch is coming from.
This is one of the problems that arises when people learn to DJ this way. Just because your tracks dont have corresponding keys next to them does not mean they are not compatible. Mixing in key is supposed to be used as a guideline to help you plan and control the flow of energy. It is not meant to be some unspoken rule that says your sets must follow a harmonic pattern! They dont. Your set does not need to follow predictable keys just as it does not need to be a specific temp the whole time. Sets are supposed to be dynamic, spontaneous, and engaging. Nit picking details of your sets like this is a major crutch. It narrows your focus down into irrelevant technical aspects when your time would be better spent just playing around with the songs in your set.
Again, this applies only to transition DJs. If you're actually MIXING, they should always be in compatible keys. Don't knock strict harmonic mixing. It encourages DJs to actually mix, rather than do 64-bit transitions during breakdowns. I Don't care how smooth you get at that, it's crap compared to actual DJing.
Ralph Alderette
06.12.2012
Make sure you mess with the order of your songs to experiment
Loops are your friend. Especially to make your own transitions & breakdowns
Maxwell Zubke
05.12.2012
I understand where Patch is coming from.
This is one of the problems that arises when people learn to DJ this way. Just because your tracks dont have corresponding keys next to them does not mean they are not compatible. Mixing in key is supposed to be used as a guideline to help you plan and control the flow of energy. It is not meant to be some unspoken rule that says your sets must follow a harmonic pattern! They dont. Your set does not need to follow predictable keys just as it does not need to be a specific temp the whole time. Sets are supposed to be dynamic, spontaneous, and engaging. Nit picking details of your sets like this is a major crutch. It narrows your focus down into irrelevant technical aspects when your time would be better spent just playing around with the songs in your set.

Another reason people get so sensitive about this topic is because they ARE trying to improve. People have a hard time taking criticism about something they put so much effort into. This usually results in newer, "up-and-coming" DJs that are completely close-minded and believe anybody talking about the way they perform is attacking them. The reason that this bothers me enough to actually say something is because this attitude is contrary to the supportive, educational group dynamic that is so important. Furthermore, it gets masked in this facade of "tips" and "effect combinations" so people actually do believe they are getting better.

I'm not coming down on you! I just want to add some perspective. I will follow up with a more helpful comment. I just had to get that off my chest.
Lashawn Maycock
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by Patch
There is so much wrong with this thread - I don't know where to start.


Patch, just had a butchers at your SC page, really like the 'Enter the Natural Mystic' track, would slip in nicely on my Rave Breaks/Future Jungle bit on me radio show. Is there a version available to play? Speaking of Nu-Rave, couple of the other DJ's on there are Brizzol based and I'm not too far from there myself. Things are moving forward with the station in the New Year and looking for some additional DJ's/Shows, just wondered if you're interested? Probably ought to take this off line. I'll follow you on SC in sec.

BTTF aka Lofty
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by Patch
There is so much wrong with this thread - I don't know where to start.
What do you find so repulsive? People are just giving advice/opinions on what works.
Brunilda Kora
05.12.2012
There is so much wrong with this thread - I don't know where to start.
Lillia Datson
05.12.2012
If they cant blend very well, i try and find a relatively clean part of the tune, usually the intro if its an instrumental, and use a cue point to switch to it, then have the next track's vocals/synthee bits etc come in over the top for about a minute and cut in when the bass starts going ''Wububububaaa''

If thats makes any sense....
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by MyUsername
Avid dubstep mixer here.

^I agree with that post.

I find that EQing properly makes loong (over 1 minute of playing together is long IMO) blends a breeze if you choose the right songs. This how I do 95% of my transitions: have all the EQ killed and add and subtract frequencies to your liking.
But I would advise against using this kind of mixing with heavy dubstep with lots of prominent stuff going on or tunes with a lot of vocals, if you got a tune like that on your hands then I say work a quick transition out. Or mix only in the break.
Or if you reach a 16 bar break, start the incoming track at bar 16 instead of bar 1, then you can double drop if you want.

Maybe upload a mix for more directed answers.
Alright. Thanks for all the replys. I'll be uploading a mix sometime today. Thanks again for all the feedback, this site is pretty much the shit!
Nereida Jasnoch
05.12.2012
Avid dubstep mixer here.

^I agree with that post.

I find that EQing properly makes loong (over 1 minute of playing together is long IMO) blends a breeze if you choose the right songs. This how I do 95% of my transitions: have all the EQ killed and add and subtract frequencies to your liking.
But I would advise against using this kind of mixing with heavy dubstep with lots of prominent stuff going on or tunes with a lot of vocals, if you got a tune like that on your hands then I say work a quick transition out. Or mix only in the break.
Or if you reach a 16 bar break, start the incoming track at bar 16 instead of bar 1, then you can double drop if you want.

Maybe upload a mix for more directed answers.
Tatiana Verdeja
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by Zygote
My bad yo. I should have made my question much more clear. Transitioning is a much better word to use. I'm struggling with "transitioning" during the break down. Lets say track B is playing and it reaches its 16 bar breakdown, and I start playing track A with its 32 bar intro and in hopes of transitioning into track A by time track B has finished its breakdown and has began its build up. Do I bring track A slowly into track B even though it has clashing elements. Eq'ing can only do so much, you know what I mean? Whats your take on something like this?
You just described the absolute bare-minimum of DJing.... Easiest thing you can really do. It's really a thing that just takes learning and feeling out.
My suggestion would be to:

A: Work on track selection, so you're not transitioning between two tracks that don't work together. A lot of new DJs have it in their head that "if a DJ is good enough, they can go between any two tracks" and that's not true at all. A good DJ knows which tracks to play together.

B: work on in/out points, so that you're using the intro of track A, while track B is winding up to go into the breakdown, then you can EQ track B so it's less prominent, without it sounding abrupt, because you've built context with track A.
Matt Kane
05.12.2012
if they
Cole Maroto
05.12.2012
When I mixed dubstep I didn't have very many long winded blends. It was a lot of quick cuts by swapping drops or only using the build up of a song then dropping another. Most of the time I hear dubstep djs doing a lot of longer transitions it usually sounds awful. There's too much going on so it just sounds too busy and at the same time really flat because there's no more headroom.

As far as your question, I tend to not bother mixing things that aren't harmonically compatible and will lead to dissonance. I guess you could change the key if youre using software...as long as it doesn't make the song sound wierd. Some types of effects would probably work too.
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
Well... Mixing is not synonymous with DJing. Most DJs "transition" but they call it "mixing".
Every Dubstep DJ I've ever heard (and I've heard hundreds more than I'd like) has just transitioned between tracks during breakdowns/buildups, and called that "mixing". Is that what you're talking about, or are you talking about double dropping and mixing actual verses?
My bad yo. I should have made my question much more clear. Transitioning is a much better word to use. I'm struggling with "transitioning" during the break down. Lets say track B is playing and it reaches its 16 bar breakdown, and I start playing track A with its 32 bar intro and in hopes of transitioning into track A by time track B has finished its breakdown and has began its build up. Do I bring track A slowly into track B even though it has clashing elements. Eq'ing can only do so much, you know what I mean? Whats your take on something like this?
Tatiana Verdeja
05.12.2012
Well... Mixing is not synonymous with DJing. Most DJs "transition" but they call it "mixing".
Every Dubstep DJ I've ever heard (and I've heard hundreds more than I'd like) has just transitioned between tracks during breakdowns/buildups, and called that "mixing". Is that what you're talking about, or are you talking about double dropping and mixing actual verses?
Donnetta Enrile
05.12.2012
Originally Posted by whiskeyflip
People actually *mix* dubstep?
What else would it be called? Its not just cut and paste.
Tatiana Verdeja
05.12.2012
People actually *mix* dubstep?

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