S2 vs S4
S2 vs S4 Posted on: 19.03.2012 by Timothy Natour I have the perfect cunning plan to make money, by July I will have approx $1120, by earning $10 a day for four months. But now, i have two choices, I want to know the upsides for getting a S2 , and so for an S4. I will mash songs, but I probably be doing a lot of looping and layering to make my own ones. This is what I plan to get from the DJTT store S2+Tma-1 headphones+ Midifighter=$798 and $322 left over. Or S4 + tma1 headphones+ Midifighter= 1223 and I need $103 from my parents, but it's the minimum. So help me decide. | |
| Robbyn Student 06.01.2013 | Yes, I am resurrecting this thread for my own purposes. Ok... I have haphazardly looked at the previous posts on this thread. From what I have seen, there is yet to be a definitive solution or even general consensus to the original question:
Originally Posted by BitPixel
I am a former S4 owner. ("Former S4 owner" because my S4 was stolen about a year ago, but that's another story for another day.) This past holiday season, I was fortunate enough to receive a blank check from my in-laws to choose any controller I wanted. I chose the Vestax VCI-400. While I really like the VCI-400 - it's a well built metal chassis workhorse with plenty of options for remapping extra buttons...I am considering trading the VCI-400 for a S2 + Midi Fighter 3D instead. The issue I have with my VCI-400 is that it is way too cluttered for my workflow. I have big fat fingers. I have rehearsed routines with the VCI-400 where I accidentally rewound, jumped the track forward or stopped the music while having the wrong function activated or accidentally touching the jog wheels. IMHO, in rehearsal, these repeat mistakes can happen. But risking accidents like these in a live setting is just asking for trouble. Plus, NI has yet to add the VCI-400 as a native-supported controller for Traktor, when it is supposedly Vestax's top tier (therefore, triggering minor troubleshooting each time I set up somewhere new). Originally, when this thread started, the F1 was not yet available, nor was the DJTT Remix Deck Hack Project. To explain my logic about downsizing from the VCI-400 and S4 to the smaller S2... When I had my S4, I rarely used Decks C + D. Now that Decks C + D can be used as Remix Decks (where as when I had my S4, C + D were track decks only) I am seeing the value in using them as Remix Decks. Often, I found it difficult to make room for the S4 in some of the clubs I frequently play. The Sample Record and Loop sections on the S4 often remained unused. I live a total tech geek lifestyle where my whole apartment is wired like The Batcave. I have been a DJ and producer for close to 20 years. My primary genre is Electro House and Rock Mashups My question is: With my advanced experience level and the newer tech available than when this thread began, would it make sense to downgrade to an S2 to control Deck A + B and use the MIDI Fighter 3D to control effects and Remix Deck samples on C + D? What are your thoughts about the PROs and CONs before I make the trip to return the VCI-400? |
| Ok Moroski 21.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by Culture_Shock
Plus, if he outgrows/decides he doesn't want the x1, he can sell it pretty easily for a decent amount of his investment. If he decides he doesn't want one of the controllers you mentioned he's going to have a very difficult time selling them. He'll probably be out $30-50 with either option at the end of the day (assuming he sells them) but at least with the X1 he has a controller that's far less likely to break in the interim and is far more useful. Then, down the line, if he moves from the S4 to DVS he'll be happy to have the X1 - I know I was. Especially if it's within his budget (which it sounds like it is) I don't see any reason to go with say, an LPD8 over an X1. Buy smart, buy once. |
| Robbyn Student 06.01.2013 | Yes, I am resurrecting this thread for my own purposes. Ok... I have haphazardly looked at the previous posts on this thread. From what I have seen, there is yet to be a definitive solution or even general consensus to the original question:
Originally Posted by BitPixel
I am a former S4 owner. ("Former S4 owner" because my S4 was stolen about a year ago, but that's another story for another day.) This past holiday season, I was fortunate enough to receive a blank check from my in-laws to choose any controller I wanted. I chose the Vestax VCI-400. While I really like the VCI-400 - it's a well built metal chassis workhorse with plenty of options for remapping extra buttons...I am considering trading the VCI-400 for a S2 + Midi Fighter 3D instead. The issue I have with my VCI-400 is that it is way too cluttered for my workflow. I have big fat fingers. I have rehearsed routines with the VCI-400 where I accidentally rewound, jumped the track forward or stopped the music while having the wrong function activated or accidentally touching the jog wheels. IMHO, in rehearsal, these repeat mistakes can happen. But risking accidents like these in a live setting is just asking for trouble. Plus, NI has yet to add the VCI-400 as a native-supported controller for Traktor, when it is supposedly Vestax's top tier (therefore, triggering minor troubleshooting each time I set up somewhere new). Originally, when this thread started, the F1 was not yet available, nor was the DJTT Remix Deck Hack Project. To explain my logic about downsizing from the VCI-400 and S4 to the smaller S2... When I had my S4, I rarely used Decks C + D. Now that Decks C + D can be used as Remix Decks (where as when I had my S4, C + D were track decks only) I am seeing the value in using them as Remix Decks. Often, I found it difficult to make room for the S4 in some of the clubs I frequently play. The Sample Record and Loop sections on the S4 often remained unused. I live a total tech geek lifestyle where my whole apartment is wired like The Batcave. I have been a DJ and producer for close to 20 years. My primary genre is Electro House and Rock Mashups My question is: With my advanced experience level and the newer tech available than when this thread began, would it make sense to downgrade to an S2 to control Deck A + B and use the MIDI Fighter 3D to control effects and Remix Deck samples on C + D? What are your thoughts about the PROs and CONs before I make the trip to return the VCI-400? |
| Johnetta Olewine 24.03.2012 | Yes. It's pretty reasonable too |
| Timothy Natour 24.03.2012 | Just checking, do DJTT ship to Australia? |
| Mariah Hegemann 22.03.2012 | Not sure if trolling, or if just not doing research. The F1 is to control Traktor's new remix decks, primarily. Yeah, it does have some limited effects control and is mappable, but it serves a different purpose than the Midi Fighter. The MF, depending on the mapping, is for controlling the track decks and effects. I also understand that you wouldn't be buying all of the controllers at one point, but it really would be best to 1) buy the S4 and things like headphones, cables, and monitors and then 2) learn everything you can about what the S4 can do through experience. Once you have a grasp of what your controller can do, then you should believe about expanding your setup. |
| Timothy Natour 22.03.2012 | I'm saying the f1 would replace the Midifighter, I wouldn't get them all at once |
| Mariah Hegemann 22.03.2012 | OP, I would recommend slowing down a bit. Buying that much stuff all in one go may be overwhelming, and in a couple of months, you may not even want the gear. Just stick with the S4 to start, save your money, and take some time to really learn the S4. It's a great unit, but I wouldn't overwhelm myself with it and somme extra auxiliary controllers. I'd wait a couple of months until after you've gotten comfortable with the S4 to buy anything else. |
| Timothy Natour 22.03.2012 | The kontrol f1 will be out by the time I have the money! What are your thoughts on this |
| Ok Moroski 21.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by Culture_Shock
Plus, if he outgrows/decides he doesn't want the x1, he can sell it pretty easily for a decent amount of his investment. If he decides he doesn't want one of the controllers you mentioned he's going to have a very difficult time selling them. He'll probably be out $30-50 with either option at the end of the day (assuming he sells them) but at least with the X1 he has a controller that's far less likely to break in the interim and is far more useful. Then, down the line, if he moves from the S4 to DVS he'll be happy to have the X1 - I know I was. Especially if it's within his budget (which it sounds like it is) I don't see any reason to go with say, an LPD8 over an X1. Buy smart, buy once. |
| Deangelo Boender 21.03.2012 | and don't go for the midi fighter! I have one, I love it, but I have to admit that it wasn't totally worth it. |
| Deangelo Boender 21.03.2012 | I believe that as a budding dj, it would be a better experience for you to get a blank set of buttons that you can program yourself, versus a pre-mapped controller that you just have to sit down and learn. the x1 is a nice unit, but you're just going to be overwhelmed with learning all the features of the s4 and the x1. I would recommend that once you know your s2/s4 inside and out get something like an lpd8, nano pad, or even a nano control. learning how to map midi controls and finding effects combos that are all your own is a very powerful skill set that can set you apart from other djs. Besides that, they're a fraction of the price of an x1, and you can map them do exactly what an x1 does and more. |
| Ok Moroski 21.03.2012 | First, apologies to DJTT; I love what you guys are doing here, and I love that you're innovating. However, I'm going to speak my mind here: Among other things, I currently own an S4, Midi Fighter, and an X1. I will tell you right now that the Midi Fighter is mostly a novelty for me at this point; it's nice to quickly apply effects, but being unable to adjust dry/wet, rate, and effects for multiple decks with it makes it a secondary concern. It's a bit easier to apply multiple effects with the MF, but most of the time you end up just having them clash or overpower your mix. I pretty much only use the gater and beatmasher on it at this point - the LFOs get stale very quickly since they're always the same rate, the reverb needs to be able to be fine tuned, same with the echo, and same with the LoFi. I've worked around all that a little bit by using the X1 to adjust the dry/wet and rate (which I suppose you could do with the S4), but I'd say the MF looks a lot better on paper/in DJTT's marketing videos than in practice, to be perfectly honest. Also, the IG mapping kinda locks you in effects-wise; you get a solid set to start, but when you want to start messing around with other options you're a bit limited. Finally, if you really want the whole instant-effects deal, you can always remap your x1 or use the midi layer to accomplish that; it won't be exactly like the MF, but it'll be customizable to what you want it to do. The MF isn't magical - it's just a midi controller that works very well with DJTT's mappings for it. You could easily create just as useful of an effects controller with an X1 in midi mode and then have all of native mode AND the top half of it in midi mode free to map however you want. Practicality says $175 for 16 buttons ("48" with the toggling in 4 decks mode) versus $200 for 32 buttons, 8 knobs, 4 encoders (times two with midi mode, and an extra 16 buttons with hotcue mode... oh, and another layer for BOTH with the shift button)... you're better off with the X1. As I said, I own both and I'd say unequivocally that the X1 is a FAR better value for the money. You've got to really really really want arcade buttons for the MF to be a better purchase. Perhaps I'm just not using the MF to its fullest... but still, I'm seriously considering selling it to help fund the purchase of an F1 or a second X1. |
| Shonda Derouchey 20.03.2012 | I would personally go for a MIDI Fighter if you get the S4 just because its a lot more versatile to play the MF similar to an instrument. You can do everything the X1 does on an S4. Get the S4, a foot switch and a MF. IMHO |
| Timothy Natour 20.03.2012 | Thank you all for the support, I've decided i should go ahead and get the S4 but I've seen a lot of stuff going through the comments, X1 and Midifighter, kind of like mac vs pc So what do you prefer, X1 or Midifighter, I wish this was a poll Thanks guys! |
| Mariah Hegemann 20.03.2012 | OP, I'm just going to tell you what everyone else did, but as an S2 owner, get the S4 if you have the money. It has a lot of room and functionality for you to explore as you grow. That being said, the S2 isn't a bad piece of kit-I love mine-but if you can get the S4, do so. Also, just so you know, the Midifighter nor the S4 are intended (intended) for producing your own music. They can be mapped to control DAWs, but there are much better dedicated controllers out there for production. The MF and the S4, X1, F1, etc. are most definitely intended for DJing. If you wanted to get your own production setup in addition to a DJing setup, you could always get the S2 setup you mentioned in the OP sans MF and use the extra cash to buy a midi keyboard (or even something like a Maschine Mikro) some production software. You won't be missing out from the S4, as the S2 is a great controller (and you get the added benefit of having a booth out) and you'll have some good production stuff to start out with. |
| Timothy Natour 20.03.2012 | I was speaking about the f1 thx |
| Christel Croak 20.03.2012 | The S4 will give you more room to develop as a DJ. Even if you're only starting out now, mixing with two decks, if you believe that in the future the idea of mixing 4 decks interests you, the S4 is a better idea because you'll have you sell the S2 and then pick up an s4. If you have an idea where you want to go, it's better to save up and just buy what you'd want in the end, it usually ends up being cheaper anyways. |
| Shonda Derouchey 19.03.2012 | Also, I bought my S4 from Zzounds.com with a payment plan. Its called pay as you play. They have the S2 for $399 just like on DJTT store, or 4 payments of $99 dollars. I bought my S4 on this plan, it cost me $899 or 4 payments of 243.00. Something to look into. |
| Shonda Derouchey 19.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by oliosky
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| Shonda Derouchey 19.03.2012 | Umm... The X1 has been out for a while. You can usually find them used for about $140 in like new condition on this very website in the buy/sell section. I believe you're mistaking the X1 for the F1 which has not come out yet, I believe the price tag is either $299 or $399. I'm planning to wait it out and get the F1 when Native Instruments drops the price to near half that in 6 months. Seems to be a trend with NI. |
| Timothy Natour 19.03.2012 | As I said in the original post, I want to be able to creat my own songs With stuff like the midi fighter. The x1 looks like something that I want |
| Timothy Natour 19.03.2012 | An x1 would be great, but when do they come out And how much are they |
| Yong Aptekar 19.03.2012 | If you can save for the s4, get it. If you can only afford the S2, get that and add other controllers (midifighter, X1, F1, K2) later on once you are comfortable with mixing. The nice thing about both is that they hold their value. So if you do want to upgrade later, you won't loose so much money. |
| Timothy Natour 19.03.2012 | So S2 is better starting out and maybe I should get a S4 later? Right? |
| Johnetta Olewine 19.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by MosinN
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| Shonda Derouchey 19.03.2012 | Thanks man! |
| Ok Moroski 19.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by DStridium
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| Shonda Derouchey 20.03.2012 | Honestly I have an S4, IMO get the S4 and a Kontrol X1 instead of a midi fighter for now. If you're just starting out you should really get an S4, decent headphones, and some desktop monitors. I promise the S4 will be more than enough to learn on and when you feel limited expand then to the MF, MFP, X1, or F1. Save that money for music, my man. Heres a link to a pair of monitors to start out on. http://www.zzounds.com/item--BEHMS16 |
| Ok Moroski 20.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by Hoodless
The MF is cool, but I'd take an S4 over a MF and S2. Also, after having the MF for a few months now I'd say you're better off with an X1 long term. The MF IG mapping is nice for quickly applying effects, but an X1 allows you to apply effects dynamically - adjusting rate, dry/wet, etc. so you don't have the same sound over and over. Then again, you could get both and have the best of both worlds. |
| Alla Bluemke 20.03.2012 | Personally I had an s2 and an s4. To me the s2 is more then enough. two channel, sample decks and cue points. plus it has a midi mode. With the DJTT mapping it pretty good to do everything. The s4 is nice with 4 channels but I never used all 4 channels. The biggest plus is its scratch capable, so for turntables it could be nice, but besides thats its not worth it. |
| Jannie Sinda 19.03.2012 | I have the S2. It's pure basic stuff. Nothing complicated. If you're just mixing simple then S2 would be it. That is if you're don't intend to do complex stuff. If you want more complicated mixing adding sounds everywhere then get the bigger brother S4. Take it this way you're paying for a stock car without options (S2), or you can pay for a car with options like BOSE surround added (S4) |
| Dione Haimes 19.03.2012 | Leave the midifighter, get s4 and TMA's Get midifighter, or MFpro at later date |
| Yong Aptekar 19.03.2012 | aside from size, the big difference is 2 decks vs. 4 |
| Somer Vanstraten 19.03.2012 | If you have the money, go for the s4, more functions, 4 channel mixer, only con is the size. Are you going to use is as a mobile DJ or at home? in the second case size no matters |
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