Calvin Harris
and Dillon Francis
worked there... no way!
| Needles, Slipmats & Settings Gunna get straight to the point looking for a good pair of needles for under/around $200 no scratching here just mixing I was looking at the "Ortofon Pro S Concorde" (Pair) for $190..any suggestions feedback?
Also I have some simple slipmats wondering if they make any difference...if so any recommendations? (again I dont scratch, just mix)
Last question: what settings do you keep your turntables at? (Height, anti-skate, counter-weight, etc.)
THANKS | Lashawn Maycock
14.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by rgtb
BTTF,
I am mostly passing on information from the Ortofon website (see here).
But I have some intuition of my own. (Please take this with a grain of salt, I was never good in physics.) During regular playback, with anti-skating at 0, a skating force F_s results (why this force results you can easily find on wikipedia) which pulls the tonearm towards the center of the disc. Setting anti-skating to F_s exerts (approximately) a force F_s in the opposite direction, making the net lateral force on the groove walls (approximately) zero.
If you backcue the record, there will be a skating force, too. However, as the record now rotates counter-clockwise, the skating force goes in the other direction. But the anti-skating force hasn't changed! So when you backcue, the anti-skating force gets added to the skating force, not substracted. So it can now happen very easily that you pull the stylus out of the record during fast back-cueing.
So the above is my intuition. Not 100% sure it is right.
As for your L-R audio imbalance question. My understanding is changes in the angle between the cartridge head and groove which occur because the tonearm moves in an arc across the record are the primary cause of problems with the stereo image. Skating forces aren't so important there. Again, these are just my 2c and I'm not 100% sure on this.
Thanks again for the reply, much appreciated. Actually that does make sense regarding the direction of force, hadn't thought of that, as you suggest the direction of rotation is reversed during back cueing, therefore the centripetal force acts in the opposite direction. Interesting, def will be trying this setup. Cheers. | Lashawn Maycock
14.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by rgtb
yes, there is. high antiskating will give you troubles when back-cueing. if you back-cue (most DJs do), it is advisable to set anti-skating to zero (or, perhaps, half the tracking force at the most if you're being careful).
of course, for hi-fi usage (no scratching, no back cueing), it's different. in that case, on a technics, set the anti-skating to the tracking force. ofc, the max. anti-skate on the mk2 is 3g so you cannot follow this rule if your cartridge requires a tracking force of >3g. but for pure playback/non DJ purposes, you should go for a hifi cart anyway. and every hifi cart i know requires less than 3g of tracking force.
edit: @hoodless -- as for the other thread that was closed: zeus is a botnet. they steal people's financial credentials. i was just kidding. (the joke having to do with the fact that cracked software is sometimes malware-infected.) no need to get all worked up.
Cheers, many thanks RGTB for the info, very interesting, in all these years of DJing, I still learn something new everyday! Just thought, couldn't setting anti-skate to zero cause a possible L-R audio imbalance and leave the stylus more liable to skipping during play back because of the centripetal force acting on the tonearm? But having seen the number of set ups above using zero this doesn't appear to be the case when using specific cart/styli (i.e. Shure) and setting them up in a certain configuration. I will have to give this a try!
Cheers again, all the best.
BTTF | Ngan Ernestine
14.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by backtothefront
Still interesting to see many people have anti-skate to zero, just wondered if there was a technical/technique reason for this?
yes, there is. high antiskating will give you troubles when back-cueing. if you back-cue (most DJs do), it is advisable to set anti-skating to zero (or, perhaps, half the tracking force at the most if you're being careful).
of course, for hi-fi usage (no scratching, no back cueing), it's different. in that case, on a technics, set the anti-skating to the tracking force. ofc, the max. anti-skate on the mk2 is 3g so you cannot follow this rule if your cartridge requires a tracking force of >3g. but for pure playback/non DJ purposes, you should go for a hifi cart anyway. and every hifi cart i know requires less than 3g of tracking force.
edit: @hoodless -- as for the other thread that was closed: zeus is a botnet. they steal people's financial credentials. i was just kidding. (the joke having to do with the fact that cracked software is sometimes malware-infected.) no need to get all worked up. | Lashawn Maycock
12.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by bumtsch
It just so happens that the sweet spot for antiskating on my decks is close to the tracking force I'm at.
I'll have to bring a blank next time I get to play on 1200s and see if that still holds...
2x Vestax pdx a1 mk2, Ortofon Concorde Pro S, Traktor Butter Rugs, weight ~2.5g, anti-skate ~2.5g
That said, I've worried for a while about wearing off one side of the groove more than the other using a wrong anti-skating value. Might have been more due to the styli being battered when I first got the decks than that, though (concorde pro OM on gemini headshells).
Thanks for the reply, I'm similar, I'm concerned with uneven wear over time. I play house so scratching is not something I induldge in much - I'm more concerned with good audio representation. | Lashawn Maycock
12.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by hipnopath
The Shure M44-7 manual says to just set it to zero for turntablism/scratching. If you want to properly set it, here's how:
Ah, okay, thanks, that answers it then. I wondered if it was a technical reason (in DJ technique terms). | Delila Vandommelen
12.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by backtothefront
Still interesting to see many people have anti-skate to zero, just wondered if there was a technical/technique reason for this?
Technics set up says anti-skate should match the load (weight) figure.
Cheers,
Curious BTTF
It just so happens that the sweet spot for antiskating on my decks is close to the tracking force I'm at.
I'll have to bring a blank next time I get to play on 1200s and see if that still holds...
2x Vestax pdx a1 mk2, Ortofon Concorde Pro S, Traktor Butter Rugs, weight ~2.5g, anti-skate ~2.5g
That said, I've worried for a while about wearing off one side of the groove more than the other using a wrong anti-skating value. Might have been more due to the styli being battered when I first got the decks than that, though (concorde pro OM on gemini headshells). | Verona Spradlin
11.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by backtothefront
Still interesting to see many people have anti-skate to zero, just wondered if there was a technical/technique reason for this?
Technics set up says anti-skate should match the load (weight) figure.
Cheers,
Curious BTTF
The Shure M44-7 manual says to just set it to zero for turntablism/scratching. If you want to properly set it, here's how:
| Lashawn Maycock
14.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by rgtb
BTTF,
I am mostly passing on information from the Ortofon website (see here).
But I have some intuition of my own. (Please take this with a grain of salt, I was never good in physics.) During regular playback, with anti-skating at 0, a skating force F_s results (why this force results you can easily find on wikipedia) which pulls the tonearm towards the center of the disc. Setting anti-skating to F_s exerts (approximately) a force F_s in the opposite direction, making the net lateral force on the groove walls (approximately) zero.
If you backcue the record, there will be a skating force, too. However, as the record now rotates counter-clockwise, the skating force goes in the other direction. But the anti-skating force hasn't changed! So when you backcue, the anti-skating force gets added to the skating force, not substracted. So it can now happen very easily that you pull the stylus out of the record during fast back-cueing.
So the above is my intuition. Not 100% sure it is right.
As for your L-R audio imbalance question. My understanding is changes in the angle between the cartridge head and groove which occur because the tonearm moves in an arc across the record are the primary cause of problems with the stereo image. Skating forces aren't so important there. Again, these are just my 2c and I'm not 100% sure on this.
Thanks again for the reply, much appreciated. Actually that does make sense regarding the direction of force, hadn't thought of that, as you suggest the direction of rotation is reversed during back cueing, therefore the centripetal force acts in the opposite direction. Interesting, def will be trying this setup. Cheers. | Ngan Ernestine
14.03.2012 | BTTF,
I am mostly passing on information from the Ortofon website (see here).
But I have some intuition of my own. (Please take this with a grain of salt, I was never good in physics.) During regular playback, with anti-skating at 0, a skating force F_s results (why this force results you can easily find on wikipedia) which pulls the tonearm towards the center of the disc. Setting anti-skating to F_s exerts (approximately) a force F_s in the opposite direction, making the net lateral force on the groove walls (approximately) zero.
If you backcue the record, there will be a skating force, too. However, as the record now rotates counter-clockwise, the skating force goes in the other direction. But the anti-skating force hasn't changed! So when you backcue, the anti-skating force gets added to the skating force, not substracted. So it can now happen very easily that you pull the stylus out of the record during fast back-cueing.
So the above is my intuition. Not 100% sure it is right.
As for your L-R audio imbalance question. My understanding is changes in the angle between the cartridge head and groove which occur because the tonearm moves in an arc across the record are the primary cause of problems with the stereo image. Skating forces aren't so important there. Again, these are just my 2c and I'm not 100% sure on this. | Lashawn Maycock
14.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by rgtb
yes, there is. high antiskating will give you troubles when back-cueing. if you back-cue (most DJs do), it is advisable to set anti-skating to zero (or, perhaps, half the tracking force at the most if you're being careful).
of course, for hi-fi usage (no scratching, no back cueing), it's different. in that case, on a technics, set the anti-skating to the tracking force. ofc, the max. anti-skate on the mk2 is 3g so you cannot follow this rule if your cartridge requires a tracking force of >3g. but for pure playback/non DJ purposes, you should go for a hifi cart anyway. and every hifi cart i know requires less than 3g of tracking force.
edit: @hoodless -- as for the other thread that was closed: zeus is a botnet. they steal people's financial credentials. i was just kidding. (the joke having to do with the fact that cracked software is sometimes malware-infected.) no need to get all worked up.
Cheers, many thanks RGTB for the info, very interesting, in all these years of DJing, I still learn something new everyday! Just thought, couldn't setting anti-skate to zero cause a possible L-R audio imbalance and leave the stylus more liable to skipping during play back because of the centripetal force acting on the tonearm? But having seen the number of set ups above using zero this doesn't appear to be the case when using specific cart/styli (i.e. Shure) and setting them up in a certain configuration. I will have to give this a try!
Cheers again, all the best.
BTTF | Ngan Ernestine
14.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by backtothefront
Still interesting to see many people have anti-skate to zero, just wondered if there was a technical/technique reason for this?
yes, there is. high antiskating will give you troubles when back-cueing. if you back-cue (most DJs do), it is advisable to set anti-skating to zero (or, perhaps, half the tracking force at the most if you're being careful).
of course, for hi-fi usage (no scratching, no back cueing), it's different. in that case, on a technics, set the anti-skating to the tracking force. ofc, the max. anti-skate on the mk2 is 3g so you cannot follow this rule if your cartridge requires a tracking force of >3g. but for pure playback/non DJ purposes, you should go for a hifi cart anyway. and every hifi cart i know requires less than 3g of tracking force.
edit: @hoodless -- as for the other thread that was closed: zeus is a botnet. they steal people's financial credentials. i was just kidding. (the joke having to do with the fact that cracked software is sometimes malware-infected.) no need to get all worked up. | Dione Haimes
14.03.2012 | 1210 mk2, height: 2mm weight: 3g antiskate: 1
very rarely do i play my actual vinyl so im not too worried about them wearing out, 9 times out of 10 when i play i use my timecodes | Lashawn Maycock
12.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by bumtsch
It just so happens that the sweet spot for antiskating on my decks is close to the tracking force I'm at.
I'll have to bring a blank next time I get to play on 1200s and see if that still holds...
2x Vestax pdx a1 mk2, Ortofon Concorde Pro S, Traktor Butter Rugs, weight ~2.5g, anti-skate ~2.5g
That said, I've worried for a while about wearing off one side of the groove more than the other using a wrong anti-skating value. Might have been more due to the styli being battered when I first got the decks than that, though (concorde pro OM on gemini headshells).
Thanks for the reply, I'm similar, I'm concerned with uneven wear over time. I play house so scratching is not something I induldge in much - I'm more concerned with good audio representation. | Lashawn Maycock
12.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by hipnopath
The Shure M44-7 manual says to just set it to zero for turntablism/scratching. If you want to properly set it, here's how:
Ah, okay, thanks, that answers it then. I wondered if it was a technical reason (in DJ technique terms). | Delila Vandommelen
12.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by backtothefront
Still interesting to see many people have anti-skate to zero, just wondered if there was a technical/technique reason for this?
Technics set up says anti-skate should match the load (weight) figure.
Cheers,
Curious BTTF
It just so happens that the sweet spot for antiskating on my decks is close to the tracking force I'm at.
I'll have to bring a blank next time I get to play on 1200s and see if that still holds...
2x Vestax pdx a1 mk2, Ortofon Concorde Pro S, Traktor Butter Rugs, weight ~2.5g, anti-skate ~2.5g
That said, I've worried for a while about wearing off one side of the groove more than the other using a wrong anti-skating value. Might have been more due to the styli being battered when I first got the decks than that, though (concorde pro OM on gemini headshells). | Ulysses Vittetoe
11.03.2012 | I've got a 1210mkII and a 1200mkII, ortofon evening
club S, 3.0g, 0 height, 0 antiskate.
No blank records to properly set my antiskate. | Verona Spradlin
11.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by backtothefront
Still interesting to see many people have anti-skate to zero, just wondered if there was a technical/technique reason for this?
Technics set up says anti-skate should match the load (weight) figure.
Cheers,
Curious BTTF
The Shure M44-7 manual says to just set it to zero for turntablism/scratching. If you want to properly set it, here's how:
| Roxie Seldal
10.03.2012 | Technics 1200mkII's, Shure M44-7, Dskreet Slipmats
Weight 3g, Height 0, Anti-Skate 0 | Lashawn Maycock
10.03.2012 | Still interesting to see many people have anti-skate to zero, just wondered if there was a technical/technique reason for this?
Technics set up says anti-skate should match the load (weight) figure.
Cheers,
Curious BTTF | Freddie Henrichs
09.03.2012 | Technics 1200mkII's, Ortofon Pro S Concords, Stanton Slipmats.
Weight 3.3g, Height 0, Anti-Skate 0. | Dorie Scelzo
09.03.2012 | Satellite Records in Little 5 Points in Atlanta. It was in their dollar bin. I'm not sure I've ever heard what's on the other side, but I'm pretty sure it sucked. | Len Lukawski
09.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by mostapha
Shure M-447, ~2g, level tonearm, correct anti-skate (set using a blank record…the way you're supposed to).
Oh, and I use djcommunity
s.com custom slipmats.
I am going to dig through my collection in the basement and see if I have anything that's single sided. Where did you get yours from? | Dorie Scelzo
09.03.2012 | Shure M-447, ~2g, level tonearm, correct anti-skate (set using a blank record | Luella Mckenrick
09.03.2012 | 1210 MK3Ds, Ortofon Concorde Scratch, Standard Technic mats.
Weight 3.0g, Height 0, Anti-Skate 0. | Lashawn Maycock
09.03.2012 | Technics 1210s MkII, Shure M44G cart/styli, 2g, height 0, anti-skate 2, genuine Technics slipmats from mid 90s.
Interesting to see anti-skate set to zero in posts above, I presume it's to do with scratching? | Corrin Penney
09.03.2012 |
Originally Posted by smittten
1200 MK5s, Shure M477s, Butter Rugs.
Weight 3.5g, Height 0, Anti-Skate 0.
This is exactly what I use, except im on MK2's.
If youre using timecode and only mixing, you can weight the needle lighter so it doesnt wear your records as much.
Butter rugs are immense, love em. From my own experience DO NOT buy cheap, shitty mats. Get some Sick mats or butter rugs, you'll never need another pair. | Verona Spradlin
08.03.2012 | 1200 M3Ds, M44-7s, D-Styles' V2 Tablecloths
Weight: 3.3g, Height 0, Anti-Skate 0. | Len Lukawski
08.03.2012 | 1200 MK5s, Shure M477s, Butter Rugs.
Weight 3.5g, Height 0, Anti-Skate 0.
I had Ortofons back in the day and loved them. These days I have the Shures for scratching and they are amazing and blindingly good value for money. As for slipmats, I don't believe it matters too much for mixing, just make sure they're purdy. |
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