Xone 42 - 2 phono, what interface?
Xone 42 - 2 phono, what interface? Posted on: 31.10.2012 by dan samo Hi guys,Just about to pick up a Xone 42 after many weeks of drooling at the sight of the thing... Coming from an S4, this will be my first analogue mixer, so I have some questions about the implications of it 'only' having 2 phono lines. What does this effectively restrict me to? at the moment I timecode on two 1210M3D vinyl decks, and don't have any foreseeable plans to add a third-deck (technique outta my skill-range) or CD-J's (expense and don't fancy the technology) in the future. However, there's always that slim possibility that I may add 2xCD-J's in the future, so... With that said, I'm looking at getting an Audio 8 DJ rather than the smaller versions. I know this only takes 3 timecode inputs (right? please correct me if I'm wrong) but this would still be fine for me. However in light of the mixer only supporting 2 Phono, is there anything I should know? As you can probably tell, I'm not completely sure on the ins/outs and function of 2/4 Phonos. Cheers! | |
| dan samo 06.12.2012 |
Originally Posted by OmniRoss
Thanks, I'll pick up two RCA cables this weekend then in order to get the 2 extra Line channels working as Sample/Preview decks. And no, the Filter to Crossfader is the 'VCF To Xfader' button. I'm talking about the tiny red button that says 'XFX to Filter'. It has something to do with an external digital send, I believe. It's Greek to me. |
| Annalisa Shogren 06.12.2012 |
Originally Posted by afxz
XFX if I'm not wrong is just assigning the filter to the crossfader? I could be wrong of course... |
| dan samo 10.11.2012 |
Originally Posted by bumtsch
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| Delila Vandommelen 06.12.2012 | "XFX to filter" just routes the return bus through the filter. In simpler terms : on = you can filter your fx return. If you use the fx dry/wet, the returned audio does not go through your source channel(s) - it's somewhere away from them, before the master and so out of reach of your gain/eq/filter controls. that's why you need this switch. (You can verify this by ie plugging an extra source to the xfx return, muting all the usual channels and d/w knobs set to dry and still have something register on the master : that's your return. Or you can also look at the schematic in the manual.) Of course, this only makes sense if you use send/return effects. (which I don't believe work very well on the 42 due to the way dry/wet "steals" your source channel completely instead of duplicating it to the send like the two auxs do on the 92, have a close look at Loco Dice's recent video on the front page of DJTT for an illustration) |
| dan samo 06.12.2012 |
Originally Posted by OmniRoss
Thanks, I'll pick up two RCA cables this weekend then in order to get the 2 extra Line channels working as Sample/Preview decks. And no, the Filter to Crossfader is the 'VCF To Xfader' button. I'm talking about the tiny red button that says 'XFX to Filter'. It has something to do with an external digital send, I believe. It's Greek to me. |
| Annalisa Shogren 06.12.2012 |
Originally Posted by afxz
XFX if I'm not wrong is just assigning the filter to the crossfader? I could be wrong of course... |
| dan samo 05.12.2012 | Another question... this thread has been an enduring help - thanks! How would I connect the Audio 8 to a spare channel on my Xone 42 for monitoring/preview? I see that Traktor has an 'Output Preview' option. What sort of cables connect the card out to the mixer in? Is it just a plain ordinary RCA cable? And would that work just off the bat? & also, how does the Xone 42's 'Filter send' work? I have an 'XFX To Filter' button - does this channel that Dry/Wet filter nob into a pre-assigned Traktor effect? Or am I disastrously wrong, here? |
| dan samo 10.11.2012 |
Originally Posted by bumtsch
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| Delila Vandommelen 10.11.2012 | You'd have to check the specs on your Stantons, maybe they have a higher voltage output than your Concordes which are already quite loud (basic CCs are 5-6mV, CC Nightclubs mk2 are 8mv, Shure M44 are 9.5mV for comparison's sake). That being said I've used my quiet concordes on a few 92 mixers and I definitely remember having to increase the gain a bit more there too. I've used them on some Pioneers too but I can't say I really paid much attention to that... |
| dan samo 10.11.2012 | Thanks a lot bumtsch. I believe I prefer my newer faceplate too - I knew it was only cosmetic Question for other 42 owners about the phono pre-amps... how do you find it with the gain/trim? Mine is quite quiet! Even at max trim I only seem to get +6dB out of the master volume. At 0dB / 12 o' clock trim I find my Phono pre-amps only give about -6dB master output. Does anyone else find this with the 42? Guess it's a good time to purchase some external pre-amps? Further to this... my old crappy Stanton cartridge manages to hit the +10 red levels with max Trim. The Ortofon Nightclub-S's seem to be about ~4dB quieter. Is this normal? |
| Delila Vandommelen 07.11.2012 | The new ones have a dark metallic gray faceplate with black accents and white type, the old ones had that bright aluminium/inox color with red type. The faceplate is reportedly the only change in the xone range refresh so I wouldn't worry about it (if only that they look so much cooler now imho !). As for how to take advantage of dvs and two extra channels on the xone - I have an X1 (also tried a dicer). In fact, I have two but I only use one now, shift buttons do the loop cloning to C/D that I like to play with. Much more fun to me than using two X1s, three or four decks most of the time and syncing everything. At gigs I don't have the opportunity for C/D, playing b2b most of the time. In that situation the 42 has actually been used a couple times with friends plugging into the extra two channels. The rest of the time it's been on the venue's mixer, if it has four channels I just leave the cdjs plugged into these two channels as a backup or if I don't want to bring the laptop and just play straight vinyl+some of my digital files on usb sticks or cds. I frequently don't have room for even adding the x1, hence trying the dicer (led feedback is not easy to get working right/reliably so I gave up). |
| dan samo 06.11.2012 | Another quick question... Anyone familiar with the Xone faceplate designs? Unsure whether mine is the 'older' version or the newer-updated one. Mine is the one with the Allen & Heath nametag across the top-centre, with a black background behind the FX send section. Most others pictured on Google Images have a single-colour faceplate and the A&H nametag in the top-right corner above the Master Vol. Any ideas? |
| dan samo 05.11.2012 | The 42 is on my desk right now As are 2 M3D's. It's just stepping up to DVS that I'm unsure about, because of all the different options! |
| Annalisa Shogren 05.11.2012 | Haha, it's alright. Pioneer DJM T1 Pioneer DJM 400 Pioneer DJM 250 Xone 22 Xone 32 - 3 channels. Rane TTM56 If you want to stick with the big boy brands. |
| dan samo 05.11.2012 | Hmm, yeah, you make very sound points! Thanks again... sorry if I seemed obstinate, just wanted to be perfectly clear! Have read so much these last few weeks, serious gear lust, just wanting to get it all straightened out! |
| Annalisa Shogren 05.11.2012 |
Originally Posted by afxz
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| dan samo 05.11.2012 | Yes, but what I'm trying to say is... the extra 4-deck/4-input functionality of an A8: what benefit will it give me for as long as I have 2x 1210s and a 42? I have no means to control or assign tracks/loops to C/D or sample/loop decks; I don't have any MIDI controller functionality. Are you guys saying you basically use these with your laptop-mouse, for lack of any gear? Just trying to figure out how you'd actually use the benefits of an A8 when you only have 2xTT's and a mixer. |
| Annalisa Shogren 05.11.2012 | Just get the Audio 8, is the moral here! http://www.gumtree.com/p/for-sale/na...8-dj/112372128 Just so cheap, you'd probably need to buy timecodes. |
| Delila Vandommelen 05.11.2012 | Just a quick note re: the 42's USB in/out. You don't get to pick which channel you want to record/output to -one stereo in/one stereo out. If you want to use the 42 as a one channel interface to play audio with then plug it into one of your usb ports, select it as the default output as was said, but there's only one channel to pick from. Also press the mic/usb button on the mic/usb section of the 42 to enable that channel (operated by these knobs in that section, NOT one of the 4 main channels). If you want to record your mixes through it then wire your record out or booth out to the usb record in, usb to your computer, and record from the one input you get from the interface. You could wire the fx send to the usb record in, and the usb out to the fx return and setup the xone's interface for use in a third party program for send/return fx, but you might as well do that with one of the Audio6/8/10 extra channels. Can't fiddle with it much to be more precise - I believe the usb part in mine is toast. Why don't I care? Well, I have an Audio 8... You could switch timecode control from one deck over to any of the four decks if you wanted, but that's just messy. 2 for 2 would be easier to manage. However if you want to use four discrete outputs on the mixer then you need an interface with at least four stereo channels, so A8/10 it is (unless you want to go with mono splitters but that's just yucky). And as for the K2, it's a controller. Doesn't matter what your audio interface is. It's got one built-in as well but if you're getting one of NI's big boxes then you won't care much. |
| dan samo 05.11.2012 | Well my believeing at the moment is that I only have 2xTT's and would just like a simple and cost-effective DVS solution to get them working. I picked up a 4-channel mixer now because, well, sound-cards are fairly inexpensive, whereas a mixer is a real investment that you want futureproofed. Sure, I may only be using 2 channels on my Xone 42 for now, but the possibility of adding 2xCD-J's or whatnot in the future makes it a wise investment (imo). w/r/t/ Traktor... I figured getting an Audio 6 would be fine, because - honestly - I never used the other 2 Sample/track/FX decks in Traktor when I had my S4. Most of the time I didn't even have the software UI set up to display all 4 decks. I figured I could save money and get an Audio 6, and then rely on 2x DVS audio sources (i.e. my turntables), and then have room in the future for 2x Line/CD-J's, if I want to branch out to mixing with 3/4 channels. Now this thread has made all that seem like a silly plan! Haha. |
| Annalisa Shogren 05.11.2012 |
Originally Posted by afxz
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| dan samo 05.11.2012 | Aha, I'm not in a rush to buy... although this month would be nice I'm more just seriously confused! It was so much simpler with the S4... aha. So in terms of Traktor use, what does the Audio 8 give over the 6? Could I use all 4 Traktor decks / all 4 channels on my Xone 42 using only 2 input/control sources? I remember for a while I was flipping 2 decks in Traktor using only 1x turntable, simply by turning over the control vinyl, which would trigger an in-software 'focus' change to the other deck. Basically, could I practically get a real benefit out of taking the 8 over the 6, now, with only 2 turntables? I'm not in a rush to buy but I'm not going to be dropping cash on some CD-J's anytime soon... One thing I do want in the next few months however is a K2 FX unit. How would this work w/r/t the Audio 6 versus 8 situation? Thank Christ for this community ... detangling this using NI's documentation is a evening mare! |
| Annalisa Shogren 05.11.2012 |
Originally Posted by afxz
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| dan samo 05.11.2012 |
Originally Posted by OmniRoss
I am sort of on a tight budget at the moment as I have to service one of my 1210's rather unexpectedly... I do see your point about future-proofing and it being nice to have 4 channels for Traktor and others spare, etc., but at the moment I'm really budgeting for stuff that I will definitely make use of. |
| Leeanna Ayla 05.11.2012 | Agreed, a Xone 42 is a waste of money if you're only going to use two channels. If you believe you might want to use the remix/sample decks in Traktor you'll need at least an A8, plus there's the preview player that would need a channel as well if you want to use it. |
| Annalisa Shogren 05.11.2012 |
Originally Posted by afxz
Also, if you have a 4 channel mixer, you're going to want to be able to utilise all those channels if you want to. Because if not, you may as well get a really nice two channel mixer with a Traktor soundcard built in as the other two are just sat redundant... No worries! |
| dan samo 04.11.2012 | Isn't using a channel to record/monitor kind of redundant, though? I thought the main reason the 42 even has a USB out in the first place was for direct-recording. Seems silly to get a soundcard (which I only want for standard 2-deck Scratch control) for recording and sample tabs. I could be wrong though! I have just sold an S4 to switch-up to this 42 set-up, though... and I'll be honest, I never used samples/loops etc. on the S4 in a year of having it. Pretty much only used it as a 2/3 channel standard mixer. And ta, again Didn't realise it would be so simple. A relief! You've been very 'omni-' in this thread Ross - cheers pal! |
| Annalisa Shogren 04.11.2012 | I believe you may as well get a 2nd hand A8, what have you got to lose? I just route a sample deck through the spare channel and I record into Traktor through the other. For your other question, just plug the Xone into your PC, then go into sound settings in the control panel if you're a Windows user. Then in the playback tab just choose which output of the Xone you want to use. |
| dan samo 04.11.2012 | Thanks guys - very helpful in explaining how it works. I appreciate it. I believe I'll go for an A4/A6, then... I doubt my needs will ever realistically stretch to an A8/A10. Even if I add a third/fourth deck, I doubt I'll really need 3/4 decks at once all on a DVS. One more question about this mixer/sound set-up: the Xone 42 has a USB-PC out. The documentation says something about patching it to an output? What I'd like to be able to do, whilst I look for/save for Native Instruments card, is use the Xone 42 to drive my speakers and play out my ordinary PC audio. This works marvellously with the interface on my S4, obviously, and I was wondering if there's any way to achieve the same with the Xone 42? Or will I have to resort to using a basic RCA-splitter cable straight out of my PC's onboard sound? I.e. is there any way to channel my PC and its audio source through the Xone 42 and then out of the XLR main outs to my speakers? Thanks so much! |
| Annalisa Shogren 01.11.2012 | Only the A10 will support 4 x turntables. http://www.native-instruments.com/#/...o-6/?page=1963 Scroll to the bottom for comparisons between A6 and A4. http://www.native-instruments.com/#/...-10/?page=1967 And this one for the A10 and A8. The setup examples on this page should help you understand better. |
| dan samo 01.11.2012 | Am I right in believeing that the lower-end models will support 2x turntables and 1x CDJ on the master, and the larger ones will support full 4x input set-ups? |
| Edwina Fagel 01.11.2012 | Midi in's/out's and spare channels. If you gotta choose between 4/8 or 6/10 then go for Audio 4 or 8. No need for power adapter and so on. |
| dan samo 01.11.2012 | Thanks so much for clearing that up Makes more sense now! CD-J's don't use Phono - dooooh! In terms of functionality/future-proof, what would I lose between the lower-end Audio cards (i.e. 4/6) and the larger 8/10 ones? Just seeing if it makes sense or is a waste of money to go for the 'more features' 8/10 card. |
| Annalisa Shogren 01.11.2012 | CDJs are line level, so you don't need to worry about your mixer in that respect. Audio 8's can handle 2 x Turntables without a preamp e.g. Technics 1200/1210 and 2 x CDJs (or other line level audio). |
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