technics weight/set up problem

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technics weight/set up problem
Posted on: 09.07.2013 by Tegan Ruport
Hi on my 1210's the tone arm weight (on both) are pushed the forward until it stops and set to 3.5, but it's still not enough weight for my cartridges, both to jump or come off the vinyl when let say I am cuing a track. Stuck a coin on them (dont want to do this really) and they stay down. i have also looked at various Youtube clips on how to balance/set up but both my turntable fail to operate like this.

Any recommendations or do they need repairing?

Ps I have technics head shells and Stanton 500v3 needles.
Precious Pequignot
16.07.2013
Originally Posted by smiTTTen
Do they have the extra counterweight on the back? Small silver barrel that screws into the main counterweight? It's on the Mk5's and some other models and if not removed, will cause the behavior you seeing.
this.

well its not exactly on the counterweight. its at the very back of the tone arm.

an elongated silver extension that can be screwed out, which looks like the tone arm.
Desire Piedmont
11.07.2013
Originally Posted by SlvrDragon50
I wouldn't put the guard on the cart, as light as it is, it's still adding weight to the cartridge which will mess up the balance.
Good point, I was believeing of my Stanton carts that have the guard built on. But then, If I was balancing with my Ortofons, I wouldn't put the guard on.
Tegan Ruport
10.07.2013
Originally Posted by UncleFunky
A couple of things to consider.

Are the TT's on a perfectly flat surface? Get a spirit level on the job to make sure. Check your table and decks. If something is crooked, adjust the feet and see if you can make them level.

Check that the height adjustment ring is set correctly. This will vary significantly from one cartridge to another. The instructions for your cart or Google might provide you with the correct height.

Either of the above factors can cause major problems with cueing if not properly calibrated. Seriously, the weight is only a small part of the picture.

If after checking the above there are still problems. Check whether the decks need repairing and try the following. You probably saw steps one to three on YouTube:

1. Remove any vinyl from the TT and if possible put a guard on your cart.

2. Set the anti-skate to zero.

3. Adjust the counterweight until the needle arm hovers parallel to the TT deck. This is the zero point on your counterweight and so you can adjust the ring on the weight to match.

4. If there are no problems with tracking, then the arm should sit still when the anti-skate is set to zero. If it swings in one direction or another fairly quickly then you have a problem that will need servicing. Minor movement is OK but a static arm is optimal.

5. If the arm is OK set the weight to about 3 and the anti-skate to the same.

Hope this helps.

It will save you dollars to learn your way around your decks.
Cheers for the reply, once I get in from work toevening I am going to go over everything step by step again. Hopefully I can find the problem. Hopefully its just the uneven surface like you suggested. Thanks again.
Tegan Ruport
10.07.2013
Originally Posted by smiTTTen
Do they have the extra counterweight on the back? Small silver barrel that screws into the main counterweight? It's on the Mk5's and some other models and if not removed, will cause the behavior you seeing.
No its just the main counterweight that I have. And the carts are also the normal (not with the extra weight).

I believe I will just take them in somewhere for a service and see whats what.
Tegan Ruport
10.07.2013
Originally Posted by dripstep
Lighten up your hands. You need a velvet touch on those pieces of wax. No amount of additional weight is going to help if you are man handling your records. Gentle is the key.

Put the cart on, balance the arm so it floats, then add the weight that the cart recommends and you should be fine. If you aren't, be more gentle, or change the needles. Maybe they are bent/worn out.
Thank you for your reply, but not to sure where you got that I was heavy handed or man handling the vinyl as you put it, I couldn't be more gentle if I tried to be honest. And again done all what you recommened beforehand with the balancing tecnique but still the same problem. Needles are next to new also
Tegan Ruport
09.07.2013		Hi on my 1210's the tone arm weight (on both) are pushed the forward until it stops and set to 3.5, but it's still not enough weight for my cartridges, both to jump or come off the vinyl when let say I am cuing a track. Stuck a coin on them (dont want to do this really) and they stay down. i have also looked at various Youtube clips on how to balance/set up but both my turntable fail to operate like this.

Any recommendations or do they need repairing?

Ps I have technics head shells and Stanton 500v3 needles.
Federico Vilas
14.08.2013		oh yeah, they are a bitch to adjust...they can be a little lose and still do ok BUT not over tightened...I like to just replace tonearms instead of wasting a bunch of time trying to perfect the screw settings
Tegan Ruport
14.08.2013		Sorry I should have posted that I found out what the problem was weeks ago :-)

It was the tone arm screws on the 'gimbal' that were to tight, once I had loosened them and then tightented the washer around the screws I was good to go.

Thanks for all the replies and help!
Roy Houn
14.08.2013		i just had same problem mate, bought another 1210mk2 and max i could get weight to with ortofon concorde on was 2.5g and it was right up to the end, i remebered about the aux weight and low and behold it was screwed in the end, i unscrewed it and the then it was fine, it really just looks like the end of the tone arm, i had to look twice
Precious Pequignot
16.07.2013
Originally Posted by smiTTTen
Do they have the extra counterweight on the back? Small silver barrel that screws into the main counterweight? It's on the Mk5's and some other models and if not removed, will cause the behavior you seeing.
this.

well its not exactly on the counterweight. its at the very back of the tone arm.

an elongated silver extension that can be screwed out, which looks like the tone arm.
Federico Vilas
12.07.2013		it could be a bootleg or modded counter weight...

if not then there are multiple things that could be wrong

bent tonearm?
pivot screws are too tight?
anti-skate messed up?
you could have replacement rcas that are too thick and cause you not to be able to get height adjusted properly?
is your ttable level?
is your table level?
did you mount the cart correctly to the headshell?

this would be easier to give advise if we had more info like a pic, video, cart/stylus that you are using, etc.
Gaynell Rydberg
11.07.2013		Ah yea, I believe a built on guard is smart.

I only use my table for listening, but I still worry about losing the guard :| So easy to misplace.
Desire Piedmont
11.07.2013
Originally Posted by SlvrDragon50
I wouldn't put the guard on the cart, as light as it is, it's still adding weight to the cartridge which will mess up the balance.
Good point, I was believeing of my Stanton carts that have the guard built on. But then, If I was balancing with my Ortofons, I wouldn't put the guard on.
Brunilda Kora
11.07.2013		How far back on the headshell is the cart? The needle needs to be in line with the front most edge of the headshell...
Gaynell Rydberg
11.07.2013		I wouldn't put the guard on the cart, as light as it is, it's still adding weight to the cartridge which will mess up the balance.
Tegan Ruport
10.07.2013
Originally Posted by UncleFunky
A couple of things to consider.

Are the TT's on a perfectly flat surface? Get a spirit level on the job to make sure. Check your table and decks. If something is crooked, adjust the feet and see if you can make them level.

Check that the height adjustment ring is set correctly. This will vary significantly from one cartridge to another. The instructions for your cart or Google might provide you with the correct height.

Either of the above factors can cause major problems with cueing if not properly calibrated. Seriously, the weight is only a small part of the picture.

If after checking the above there are still problems. Check whether the decks need repairing and try the following. You probably saw steps one to three on YouTube:

1. Remove any vinyl from the TT and if possible put a guard on your cart.

2. Set the anti-skate to zero.

3. Adjust the counterweight until the needle arm hovers parallel to the TT deck. This is the zero point on your counterweight and so you can adjust the ring on the weight to match.

4. If there are no problems with tracking, then the arm should sit still when the anti-skate is set to zero. If it swings in one direction or another fairly quickly then you have a problem that will need servicing. Minor movement is OK but a static arm is optimal.

5. If the arm is OK set the weight to about 3 and the anti-skate to the same.

Hope this helps.

It will save you dollars to learn your way around your decks.
Cheers for the reply, once I get in from work toevening I am going to go over everything step by step again. Hopefully I can find the problem. Hopefully its just the uneven surface like you suggested. Thanks again.
Desire Piedmont
10.07.2013		A couple of things to consider.

Are the TT's on a perfectly flat surface? Get a spirit level on the job to make sure. Check your table and decks. If something is crooked, adjust the feet and see if you can make them level.

Check that the height adjustment ring is set correctly. This will vary significantly from one cartridge to another. The instructions for your cart or Google might provide you with the correct height.

Either of the above factors can cause major problems with cueing if not properly calibrated. Seriously, the weight is only a small part of the picture.

If after checking the above there are still problems. Check whether the decks need repairing and try the following. You probably saw steps one to three on YouTube:

1. Remove any vinyl from the TT and if possible put a guard on your cart.

2. Set the anti-skate to zero.

3. Adjust the counterweight until the needle arm hovers parallel to the TT deck. This is the zero point on your counterweight and so you can adjust the ring on the weight to match.

4. If there are no problems with tracking, then the arm should sit still when the anti-skate is set to zero. If it swings in one direction or another fairly quickly then you have a problem that will need servicing. Minor movement is OK but a static arm is optimal.

5. If the arm is OK set the weight to about 3 and the anti-skate to the same.

Hope this helps.

It will save you dollars to learn your way around your decks.
Tegan Ruport
10.07.2013
Originally Posted by smiTTTen
Do they have the extra counterweight on the back? Small silver barrel that screws into the main counterweight? It's on the Mk5's and some other models and if not removed, will cause the behavior you seeing.
No its just the main counterweight that I have. And the carts are also the normal (not with the extra weight).

I believe I will just take them in somewhere for a service and see whats what.
Tegan Ruport
10.07.2013
Originally Posted by dripstep
Lighten up your hands. You need a velvet touch on those pieces of wax. No amount of additional weight is going to help if you are man handling your records. Gentle is the key.

Put the cart on, balance the arm so it floats, then add the weight that the cart recommends and you should be fine. If you aren't, be more gentle, or change the needles. Maybe they are bent/worn out.
Thank you for your reply, but not to sure where you got that I was heavy handed or man handling the vinyl as you put it, I couldn't be more gentle if I tried to be honest. And again done all what you recommened beforehand with the balancing tecnique but still the same problem. Needles are next to new also
Len Lukawski
09.07.2013		Do they have the extra counterweight on the back? Small silver barrel that screws into the main counterweight? It's on the Mk5's and some other models and if not removed, will cause the behavior you seeing.
Yong Aptekar
09.07.2013		Lighten up your hands. You need a velvet touch on those pieces of wax. No amount of additional weight is going to help if you are man handling your records. Gentle is the key.

Put the cart on, balance the arm so it floats, then add the weight that the cart recommends and you should be fine. If you aren't, be more gentle, or change the needles. Maybe they are bent/worn out.

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