Quant/Sync working different on S4?
Quant/Sync working different on S4? Posted on: 19.01.2011 by Keturah Nooney Okay, so this is driving me nuts:In Ean's "AeroDynamic" video... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5IfY1IBbh4 ...he has the Daft Punk track (deck B) set to "Sync" and is able to beat juggle the hot cues (deck is not playing) off of the beat and/or rapidly. On my S4, I'm not able to do this with Quant turned either on or off. More info: Deck A (Planet Rock) Master Playing Deck B (AeroDynamic) Sync ON Quant OFF Not playing With Sync ON and Quant OFF, I'm not able to quickly press the hot cues. It's like it's trying to quantize them to the beat even though Quant is OFF. If I press play on deck B, I'm able to beat juggle the hot cues off beat/rapidly as expected. In the video, Ean clearly has Sync turned ON and is able to activate the hot cues at any time. I can only achieve this by turning Sync OFF on deck B. Am I missing something? UPDATE: Looking at the mp3s Ean provided, the hot cues don't appear to be exactly on the beat grids (?). I disabled auto-beat gridding and re-added them to the collection just to be sure. They definitely appear to be slightly off. | |
| Lilly Boos 20.01.2011 |
Originally Posted by fullenglishpint
|
| Tatum Ansaldo 20.01.2011 |
Originally Posted by Milgauss
I've done a fair bit of cue juggling with TSP on my VCI and I can tell you that with sync on you cannot start a cue anything other than quantised and synced. It's kind of the point of the sync button, that while it's locked it can't go out of sync. Hit sync just before/after you press play and you'll be fine. Btw, the 2 softwares really aren't supposed to be the same... where would be the fun in that! |
| Keturah Nooney 19.01.2011 | Okay, so this is driving me nuts: In Ean's "AeroDynamic" video... http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H5IfY1IBbh4 ...he has the Daft Punk track (deck B) set to "Sync" and is able to beat juggle the hot cues (deck is not playing) off of the beat and/or rapidly. On my S4, I'm not able to do this with Quant turned either on or off. More info: Deck A (Planet Rock) Master Playing Deck B (AeroDynamic) Sync ON Quant OFF Not playing With Sync ON and Quant OFF, I'm not able to quickly press the hot cues. It's like it's trying to quantize them to the beat even though Quant is OFF. If I press play on deck B, I'm able to beat juggle the hot cues off beat/rapidly as expected. In the video, Ean clearly has Sync turned ON and is able to activate the hot cues at any time. I can only achieve this by turning Sync OFF on deck B. Am I missing something? UPDATE: Looking at the mp3s Ean provided, the hot cues don't appear to be exactly on the beat grids (?). I disabled auto-beat gridding and re-added them to the collection just to be sure. They definitely appear to be slightly off. |
| Lilly Boos 20.01.2011 |
Originally Posted by fullenglishpint
|
| Keturah Nooney 19.01.2011 | @VanGogo - Thanks for the links. Definitely helps shed some light. They say that S4 now has new synch modes: ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Sync has a couple of options now that makes it possible to do some interesting magic. Regular Sync is still there, it has the effect of locking to the master source and centering the phase alignment, same as it does in Traktor Pro. Tempo Sync is new and enables sync on the Deck, adjusts the Deck BPM to the Master source and does NOT adjust the Phase alignment of the deck. This is useful for when all you want to do is track to the Master Source BPM. Phase Sync is new and is essentially the opposite of Tempo Sync. It does not do anything to the Deck BPM and only aligns the the phase of the deck to be in line with the master clock source. ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ Any ideas on how to set these sync types (regular, Temp or Phase)? Might be in the midi commands; I'll look toevening . Thanks again. |
| Charline Dye 19.01.2011 | Sorry I wasn't more specific. Yes the S4 is different in the way it syncs. I was just talking about having sync on and the cues being quantized. There is no phase sync, only tempo sync. http://www.native-instruments.com/fo...ighlight=phase http://www.native-instruments.com/fo...ght=phase+sync http://www.native-instruments.com/fo...ght=phase+sync http://www.native-instruments.com/fo...ght=phase+sync Don't start a tech issue thread with out doing a search. |
| Keturah Nooney 20.01.2011 | I tried to post at NI in Kontrol S4 -> Technical Issues, but it said it's waiting for "moderator approval" (?). Never posted over at there before; if it doesn't appear soon, I'll try again. |
| robin loo 20.01.2011 | i noticed that too.. did you start a thread over at NI community ?! |
| Keturah Nooney 20.01.2011 | I'm switching back-and-forth between Traktor Pro and Traktor S4 right now, and they are definitely different. I believe it's less that they are operating differently, but that Traktor Pro is more cleanly playing the quantized hot cue press where in Traktor S4 it is more garbled and cuts-out. I guess it is what it is -- just need to re-train my muscle memory a bit. |
| Tatum Ansaldo 20.01.2011 |
Originally Posted by Milgauss
I've done a fair bit of cue juggling with TSP on my VCI and I can tell you that with sync on you cannot start a cue anything other than quantised and synced. It's kind of the point of the sync button, that while it's locked it can't go out of sync. Hit sync just before/after you press play and you'll be fine. Btw, the 2 softwares really aren't supposed to be the same... where would be the fun in that! |
| Keturah Nooney 20.01.2011 | So that when I do eventually hit play, Sync mode is already on and quantized to the playing deck. Duplicating Ean's routine on an S4 is much harder than in Traktor Pro. Try it. I'm more interested in why two versions of Traktor (that are supposed to be the same) behave completely differently. |
| Tatum Ansaldo 19.01.2011 | Dare I say... why not just turn off sync? If you want rapid fire cues then surely you want sync off anyway... |
| Keturah Nooney 19.01.2011 | UPDATE: Okay, I've been able to verify that Traktor S4 is in fact behaving very differently than Traktor Pro. Here is the link for Ean's mp3s: http://www.djranking s.com/MP3%20MIx...c%20Juggle.zip Deck A: Planet Rock (Master, Playing) Deck B: Aerodynamic (Sync, Stopped) Quant ON In Traktor Pro, you can initiate the hot cues on off-beats. In Traktor S4, you CANNOT initiate the hot cues on off-beats. In Ean's video, you can see that the phase meter is not moving while he's beat juggling in the beginning (with deck B stopped and Sync turned on). When you try this in Traktor S4 (deck B stopped and Sync turned on), you see the phase meter go crazy as it tries to quantize the hot cue into the playing track. This is REGARDLESS of the setting of Quant. My theory is that Traktor Pro is using Beat Sync (beat only, no phase sync) when the deck is stopped while Traktor S4 is using Tempo Sync (beat and phase sync) while the deck is stopped. This seems like a bug, and Traktor S4 should follow the setting of Quant! |
| Charline Dye 19.01.2011 | No you are not missing anything. That is the way it worked in TPro, and the way it works In S4. I don't believe he is getting a true rapid hit in the beginning of the video. With sync and quant on if you hit the button quickly it will jump to before the cue point at times, on the cue at times, etc. He only rapidly hits buttons a few times at the beginning, but it isn't the same note each time he hits it. Watch the Aerodynamic cue points when he hits them rapidly and listen to the notes. At the end of the video SYNC IS OFF. So he is getting the rapid fire cue hits. |
<< Back to NI - Native Instruments S4/S2 Controller talkReply