setting up cue points ahead of time
setting up cue points ahead of time Posted on: 11.09.2013 by Emmitt Belback Do you guys do this? im switching over from ableton to serato and im used to cutting a track up into 4 different parts so i can jump around. Do you guys prep like this before a gig or do you select a song on stage, scroll through and then set the point? | |
| Delena Katherman 18.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by omers
"What is the added benefit to marking some of them with cue points?" "I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, I just honestly don't understand why anyone would need to or want to mark potential mix points with cue markers." The added benefit is that they are CUE points for jumping around, not just markers. I know now that you get that, but your question made it seem like you didn't. I guess you meant "what is the benefit to using markers" in general for reference, but your specific use of the word CUE was confusing. There are many different kinds of markers. And, markers are just another tool. Your argument would be similar to the whole SYNC vs. BEATMATCH BY EAR debate. Modern technology gives us all types of shortcuts, and taking advantage of them isn't necessarily a crutch. A marker is just another piece of information. Even without markers, you are still reading the waveform, and as your graphic pointed out, it isn't hard to see where the markers might be. |
| Alessandra Maxcy 18.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by jdownesbaird
Using cue points as cue points is fine, I have lots of tracks with cue points on acapella samples and stuff of that nature, it was the using them as "road signs" that I was confused about. |
| Emmitt Belback 16.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by jdownesbaird
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| Margie Pavell 15.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by omers
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| Tera Baragan 15.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by omers
If you want to make your own builds, jump parts of the song or know when to mix in an awkward song. Its also nice to have that initial starting cue in general to have another play button. It can just make your mix that much better, so why not use it if its there. |
| Augustine Mitzen 14.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by b1sh0p
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| Audrey Pinda 21.09.2013 | I don't use cue points. I probably should to some degree (I have the dicers, but mostly use them for looping when I need to extend something to properly mix out of something). I don't cue jump. I don't really want to. I really like letting tracks speak for themselves. But it's also my style of mixing, which everyone does it differently. I know most of my tracks in and out so I know when I need to mix them in without even looking at the waveforms 90% of the time. With new tracks I do tend to find myself looking at the screen more because I'm not as familiar... but that's what practice is for (and also listening to your recent batch of music purchases non-stop after you purchase them to get familiar). I see a lot of the guys locally who are into turntablism using them to a large degree, and I totally understand that. Having cue points while scratching much be such a nice feature. That being said, I pick the needle up and move it over. I run in relative mode with absolute drop 99% of the time (unless something is fucking up and I go internal). I don't jump back and forth, so it's no big deal NOT to have them. I do find it harder when I play on CDJ's w/ Serato because I can't needle drop as easily (usually using time-code CD's). It's something I'm working on, but as I don't own CDJ's to fuck around on (and none of my close friends do) it's something that will come in time. They are neat, but I really don't find myself using them. |
| Simone Wermager 20.09.2013 | Here's how I use cues: 1) My first cue is always flipped to a load marker in Traktor. For me it's just a workflow simplification step. I'm gonna beat-grid and cue the whole track you just save yourself 1 button push possibly more depending on the track. 2) Its important to me to keep my face out of the computer screen so, I set the title area to show me Beats To Cue, that way I don't have to look at the waveform as closely to know how far away I am. Agree with others on knowing your music. 3) keeping my cues spaced in 16 or 32 beat increments allows me to use the beatjump & loop function on my controllers really quickly and effectively with the help of the cue points on the controller as well. 4) I used to do this but not so much anymore, write out the lyrics in the cues on vocal tracks example (3. i touched the SKY, sky, sky) with the both matching number cues for the acapella and the original as well as making words on the break CAPITALIZED. This would be helpful when loading acapellas on different decks and matching them to the original track. As I'd load the acapella, hit the cue lyric drop down and see exactly what lines up with what quickly. When done right it's fool proof and you can go really quickly. |
| Katie Ahmady 20.09.2013 | One thing that hasn't been mentioned ITT that I do on almost every track... set a cue point for when the melody stops near the end of a song. It's so useful to be able to have the melody for song B kick in exactly when the melody for song A stops, especially when mixing tracks in keys that don't complement one another. That's my favorite way to mix between tracks that contrast heavily without raising the energy level too much. |
| Delena Katherman 18.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by omers
"What is the added benefit to marking some of them with cue points?" "I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, I just honestly don't understand why anyone would need to or want to mark potential mix points with cue markers." The added benefit is that they are CUE points for jumping around, not just markers. I know now that you get that, but your question made it seem like you didn't. I guess you meant "what is the benefit to using markers" in general for reference, but your specific use of the word CUE was confusing. There are many different kinds of markers. And, markers are just another tool. Your argument would be similar to the whole SYNC vs. BEATMATCH BY EAR debate. Modern technology gives us all types of shortcuts, and taking advantage of them isn't necessarily a crutch. A marker is just another piece of information. Even without markers, you are still reading the waveform, and as your graphic pointed out, it isn't hard to see where the markers might be. |
| Brianne Duvoisin 18.09.2013 | I don't cue juggle and I've gotten in the habit of only setting one cue point, at a drop usually, and just using beat jump to get to where I want to be relative to that point before starting to mix. After all, the way I'm going to mix in the song is always going to be relative to the drop in one fashion or another. I don't know, maybe it's strange. Works for me though. |
| Alessandra Maxcy 18.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by jdownesbaird
Using cue points as cue points is fine, I have lots of tracks with cue points on acapella samples and stuff of that nature, it was the using them as "road signs" that I was confused about. |
| Myrta Neweii 18.09.2013 | KNOW YOUR MUSIC. I will always sacrifice a 10 thousand song library for a 500 song library where I know all the tracks by heart. Its easy to set cues if you know your music. I usually do cues at 1.intro 2.first drop/drop intro 3.vocal intro/keys/break 4.second/third drop. Sometimes 5 and 6 will be points for juggling. (I use midi fighters to control my decks). |
| Emmitt Belback 16.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by jdownesbaird
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| Delena Katherman 15.09.2013 | Well, he's forgetting that these are CUE points, and not just markers, allowing you to MOVE around efficiently with the press of a CUE button if you mix that way. That has nothing to do with the ability to "instinctually know when a phrase is changing". OP, do you know what cue point juggling is? As you might expect, it's impossible without cue points. |
| Margie Pavell 15.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by omers
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| Tera Baragan 15.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by omers
If you want to make your own builds, jump parts of the song or know when to mix in an awkward song. Its also nice to have that initial starting cue in general to have another play button. It can just make your mix that much better, so why not use it if its there. |
| Delena Katherman 15.09.2013 | And let's not forget about the ability to cue jump. I don't do much of it, but reading the waveform only won't help you get around quickly. |
| Santos Lezcano 15.09.2013 | I put them in before hand and use them to let me know when to start transitioning in the next song |
| Augustine Mitzen 16.09.2013 | i was on about the tunes, cheers |
| Sonja Roybal 14.09.2013 | Of tunes that have an extra bar before the drop, or the mixing? Tunes that have an extra bar: House of Black Lanterns - Me, You, Metropolis. Almost every tune on the new ASC EP on Auxiliary. My mixing? |
| Augustine Mitzen 14.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by b1sh0p
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| Trista Karle 12.09.2013 | Waveform is great and after time can use it with great success but having say cue point 1 start cue point 2 with say hats sizzle or something cue point 3 where you'd want to bring in when outrro starts means you don't always have to worry especially since there's some tracks that aren't always layed out in 16 or 32 bar sections. Mind you I don't set cues nearly as much as I should because I can rea waveforms very well and mix in 32bar loops so makes it ok if I make sure to have everything phased correctly no crash 4 bar crash shit and cue points make this easier and less likely to happen Now key is important because when you do more then intro an outro mixing being in key means layering beyond intro. Matters lots in trance in my mind house and electro not as much but still does to extent especially when using vocals. |
| Sonja Roybal 13.09.2013 | Also, in my genres phrasing is everything. It's all about double drops. I want to know if a tune has a 64, 48 or 32 beat intro. Does it just drop or is there a breakdown before the drop? How long is that break down? Producers like ASC and House of Black Lanterns always add an extra bar or 2 in the intro. Etc |
| Sonja Roybal 13.09.2013 | The waveform in a 4 minute tune is a lot different than an 7 minute tune. Sure, I can count phrases, but a visual reminder doesn't hurt. Also, the process helps me remember a tune the first time I hear. Also, I've started mixing footwork and dnb together. Most drum and bass tunes has the same structure, but footwork is all over the place. Those producers do crazy shit with the intros. The beats are incredibly syncopated as well. I'm not playing 4 to the floor shit where the tunes are so boring I have to loop 6 at a time. |
| Alessandra Maxcy 13.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by b1sh0p
You're using software to mix that shows you the entire waveform of the song which has plenty of visual cues on when to mix without the wasted time of adding cue points as "mix here" reminders. In this screenshot I marked 13 blatantly obvious phrase changes in the song: What is the added benefit to marking some of them with cue points? Further, and I believe even more on point is that if you are capable of counting phrases or have developed the instinct to predict a phrase change (it takes time but it happens for most people) you'll be better off in the long run because if you forget to mark them, if you're using gear that doesn't have cue points or waveforms, and so on you'll still be fine. Using shortcuts like cue points to mark key phrase changes is stunting your development as a DJ and you're making it harder to instinctually know when a phrase is changing. I'm not trying to be a dick or anything, I just honestly don't understand why anyone would need to or want to mark potential mix points with cue markers. |
| Trista Karle 12.09.2013 | It is hard not to do by key.... I hate to admit but I do kit listening to music how I used to I come to rely on key with tracks I don't know. Back to cues I've taken to starting to be more strict on placing them beyond the first beat mostly when I first load the track. |
| Sonja Roybal 11.09.2013 |
Originally Posted by niknok
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| Pierre Massner 11.09.2013 | Generally before is better I believe, depends on the gig really...lack of time, stress, noise not allowing you to concentrate on listening....nah, for that kind of thing beforehand then if you spot something on the day, sure. That said I've done plenty gigs with bags of completely un-anything-ed tracks and just drop them in and mix them fine.....then again I come from vinyl and beatmixing by ear/hand. B1sh0p, browsing by key...I know what you mean, since I started keying things it's really hard not to obssess about that...BUT, I also often feel that it dictates my choice and I don't like that...being afraid I guess, also mixes can sound really sterile. Again, coming from vinyl generally we didn't have that unless you sat down with a keyboard and figured them out, and there are plenty of key-perfect tracks that sound crappy together too. Good to hide the key column sometimes I believe. |
| Iraida Linihan 11.09.2013 | I like to get the song analyzed and beat grid, get the first cute point where I want it. Most times I will skip to the end of the track and flag it as well for the out point |
| Sonja Roybal 11.09.2013 | I buy a tune. Throw into Traktor DJ on the iPad. Beat grid it. Set cue points at the first drop/64 beats before breakdown/32 beats before/beginning of breakdown/second drop. I don't usually jump between cue points, but I like to have a visual cue for good transition points. I want to know the length of breakdowns and intros for transitions and double drops. I want know if theres anything funky about the intro ie drops on upbeat/extra bar etc. Then I import it into Traktor Pro and get to mixing. I browse by key. Also, I never pre plan sets or mixes. I have a general idea of how I want to play and go from there. |
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