Dicers. Beat Gridding. Mapping???
Dicers. Beat Gridding. Mapping??? Posted on: 15.11.2013 by Brunilda Kora Does anyone know of a Traktor mapping that will allow me to beat grid my tracks using my Dicers when I load them for the first time?I'm looking to get a single "page" (ie - 5 buttons) on each Dicer (left deck/right deck) assigned to the functions that I'll need to set my beat grids... I'm using timecode vinyl, so I'll be looking to move the waveform with the vinyl, and set the inital beat marker with the Dicer. I haven't worked out in my mind how I'm gonna get the beatgrids perfect using Dicers and control vinyl, but I suspect 5 buttons will not be enough. I'll probably end up using some keyboard mappings for additional functions (ie - lock grid). Seriously - my mind just BOGGLES when I try to believe about how to beat grid using a midi controller!!! I'm getting old, folks. That logic part of my brain doesn't make these connections as quickly as you young folks! I've tried to draw out (on pen and paper!) the steps for beat gridding, and how I would midi map those - but I get TOTALLY lost! I've tried to incorporate setting a LOAD marker into the beat gridding process, and that is where my brain goes to MUSH - because, my hotcues page (on the Dicers) would be page 1 (Red - hotcues page), but I'd want the 1st hotcue button on that page to show up as YELLOW (as per Traktors load marker) and THAT Load Cue would be set from page 2 of the Dicer (ie - my beat gridding page). Confused? I am! | |
| Brunilda Kora 15.11.2013 | Thanks for all of your help so far, guys. I really should update Traktor - but I've got a stable, running version with great timecode functionality. And I know NOT TO fuck about with software when it's working well (if it ain't broke, don't fix it..!) Stewe - I'll crack open my active mapping and try to implement some of your suggestions from your earlier post! Thanks for investigating this for me!!!
Originally Posted by synthet1c
[Also - I can't recommend the Zomo MC-1000 enough. It's an awesome controller. The only gripe (and it doesn't bother me because I have Dicers!) is that there are only 3 cue buttons. An odd number for cues..? I use my Zomo mostly for navigation and looping]. I really love the way you guys have helped - I just wish there was a better explanation somewhere on HOW mappings (incl. modifiers and shifts, etc...) actually work in Traktor, so that I could help myself a little more. I'm TERRIBLE at trial and error type learning, and it feels like that's the only real way to become a mapping ninja... |
| Johnsie Kingrea 15.11.2013 |
Originally Posted by Patch
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| Kellie Myrum 15.11.2013 |
Originally Posted by synthet1c
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| Jonathan Chiuchiolo 15.11.2013 | wouldn't it be better to use the zomo under a shift for griding as you would get encoders that could make it really easy, I was believeing of your concept for this and figure to get all the functionality you require you would need to sacrifice two buttons to give you three of four shifts, but that has the problem of leaving you with only three buttons, but two of them have to increment and decrement values, which isn't ideal as you might get confused. eg. patDicer.jpg |
| Johnsie Kingrea 15.11.2013 |
Originally Posted by Patch
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| Brunilda Kora 15.11.2013 | You definitely Can have different colour LED's on a single page. My DJD mapping had all colours mapped on a single page. And I've seen Traktor mappings (but not for beat griding) that have differnt colour buttons on a single page. The only buttons that cannot have different colours are the page select (smal) buttons. Those are fixed. (1=Red, 2=Green, 3=Amber). Novation_dicer.jpg The big buttons can be any colour that can be made by mixing the 3 different LED's. You can get some pretty cool gradient effect. Dicer Programmers Guide |
| Brunilda Kora 15.11.2013 | Does anyone know of a Traktor mapping that will allow me to beat grid my tracks using my Dicers when I load them for the first time? I'm looking to get a single "page" (ie - 5 buttons) on each Dicer (left deck/right deck) assigned to the functions that I'll need to set my beat grids... I'm using timecode vinyl, so I'll be looking to move the waveform with the vinyl, and set the inital beat marker with the Dicer. I haven't worked out in my mind how I'm gonna get the beatgrids perfect using Dicers and control vinyl, but I suspect 5 buttons will not be enough. I'll probably end up using some keyboard mappings for additional functions (ie - lock grid). Seriously - my mind just BOGGLES when I try to believe about how to beat grid using a midi controller!!! I'm getting old, folks. That logic part of my brain doesn't make these connections as quickly as you young folks! I've tried to draw out (on pen and paper!) the steps for beat gridding, and how I would midi map those - but I get TOTALLY lost! I've tried to incorporate setting a LOAD marker into the beat gridding process, and that is where my brain goes to MUSH - because, my hotcues page (on the Dicers) would be page 1 (Red - hotcues page), but I'd want the 1st hotcue button on that page to show up as YELLOW (as per Traktors load marker) and THAT Load Cue would be set from page 2 of the Dicer (ie - my beat gridding page). Confused? I am! |
| Jonathan Chiuchiolo 16.11.2013 | no worries Pat, any time maing |
| Brunilda Kora 16.11.2013 | Hey - thanks synthet1c! Now you're talking my language (I actually understand IF's and ELSE's from my Excel days!) This is exactly the kind of plain english description of mapping functions that is MISSING from the manual! Thanks for taking the time to type that out. It has helped a lot! |
| Jonathan Chiuchiolo 15.11.2013 | yes it would be better if you mapped the encoders to move through the track and also move your grid so you can place it easier. What I was suggesting is you set a shift in the software to be able to modify your grids the idea is that if you have two buttons, you can use two buttons to make a total four shifts if you use a little "if" logic that is used in computer programming, the basic idea is if you press the first shift button you will activate M3=1 while held if you press the second shift button you will activate M3=2 while held if you are already holding the first button down and press the second button you will activate M3=3 if you wanted to have a fourth shift you could make it so if you hold button two then press button one you activate M3=4, but I just kept it the same as the third condition so it doesn't matter which order you press them, you will always activate M3=3 if you press both buttons. I have only played with traktor for about a week so I'm sure there is more to it, but basically when you set a shift you are setting a modifier up in the software, for example if you do the following Add In -> Modifier #1 -> type('button') -> interaction('hold') -> value(1); that will give you a button that will set M1=1 while you have the button pressed in, then it will return to M1=0 when released. It's exactly the same as what I was describing above, but this uses a different modifier out of the eight available. Now that you have a shift you can use it as a condition to perform actions by the dropdowns next to "Modifier Conditions", they are paired into "modifier" and "value". A condition is saying if the condition is true then perform the command you have mapped eg if M1=1 then do the command, there is no "else" so you have to enter a new command where the condition would me M1=0. What that means is that you need to map every control twice with different commands and have the shifted controls "Modifier Condition" M1=1 and anything that is unshifted you can have the "Modifier Condition" M1=0, but you don't really need that as it's implied. Hopefully that explains it a little. but you are correct, the only way to really learn is to do it until it clicks in your head. If you want to attempt it yourself you will want to use a toggling shift that goes from 0 to 1 and back again. I couldn't see any way to do it natively, but you just need the use the conditions I have been talking about and map the same button with the two commands below. Add In -> Modifier #1 -> condition('M1=0') -> type('button') -> interaction('direct') -> value(1); Add In -> Modifier #1 -> condition('M1=1') -> type('button') -> interaction('direct') -> value(0); the logic for the two buttons having three shifts is Button one Add In -> Modifier #3 -> condition('M3=0') -> type('button') -> interaction('hold') -> value(1); Add In -> Modifier #3 -> condition('M3=2') -> type('button') -> interaction('hold') -> value(3); Add out -> Modifier #3 -> range(Min=1, Max=1); Add out -> Modifier #3 -> range(Min=3, Max=3); Button two Add In -> Modifier #3 -> condition('M3=0') -> type('button') -> interaction('hold') -> value(2); Add In -> Modifier #3 -> condition('M3=1') -> type('button') -> interaction('hold') -> value(3); Add out -> Modifier #3 -> range(Min=2, Max=2); Add out -> Modifier #3 -> range(Min=3, Max=3); the syntax I have used is similar to functions, basically I want you to look for the dropdown and choose whatever is in the brackets eg. dropdown('setting'). It will hopefully become obvious when you have a look though. |
| Brunilda Kora 15.11.2013 | Thanks for all of your help so far, guys. I really should update Traktor - but I've got a stable, running version with great timecode functionality. And I know NOT TO fuck about with software when it's working well (if it ain't broke, don't fix it..!) Stewe - I'll crack open my active mapping and try to implement some of your suggestions from your earlier post! Thanks for investigating this for me!!!
Originally Posted by synthet1c
[Also - I can't recommend the Zomo MC-1000 enough. It's an awesome controller. The only gripe (and it doesn't bother me because I have Dicers!) is that there are only 3 cue buttons. An odd number for cues..? I use my Zomo mostly for navigation and looping]. I really love the way you guys have helped - I just wish there was a better explanation somewhere on HOW mappings (incl. modifiers and shifts, etc...) actually work in Traktor, so that I could help myself a little more. I'm TERRIBLE at trial and error type learning, and it feels like that's the only real way to become a mapping ninja... |
| Jonathan Chiuchiolo 15.11.2013 | no money to buy one unfortunately, And I don't really need it, I have my VCI-400 wedged between my decks and that has more than enough controls, I just wish I had full control of the leds on both layers but ah well you cant have it all |
| Johnsie Kingrea 15.11.2013 |
Originally Posted by Patch
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| Kellie Myrum 15.11.2013 |
Originally Posted by synthet1c
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| Jonathan Chiuchiolo 15.11.2013 | nope, but assuming it has a hard shift like all the other reloop controlers of the same generation, you could still map in a soft shift that is triggered in the hard shift layer to change the functionality of the encoders and a few buttons, hopefully that is understandable... it was getting a little inception for a minute there LOL |
| Kellie Myrum 15.11.2013 | synthet1c - Do you actually own a Zomo controller? |
| Kellie Myrum 15.11.2013 | Here goes nothing. If I go and save changes in 2.6 than your 2.5 would not correctly import the file... However, did downloaded to check it and found out that archive was broken. you should use a hotcue modifier as a condition to determine the color based on current cue type. Locate and select your 'hotcue type' command. Click modifier condition slot and select the hotcue you're currently assigning - from there make a deck assignment. When your modifier is all set you should notice a type selector next to it. Probably saying 'cue'. Now this tells me that at any time this particular cue is set as a standard cue the color I set in MIDI range options will be displayed. In your case you should probably go for min/max 0 - 0 (red according manual) (or grab the value with a mouse and go trough entire range) Next thing duplicate this command and map it to the same button as cue type was. This time change modifier condition in to Load and check MIDI range again and twaek it to yellow. Don't forget to change the actual cue type first! Final step would be another duplicate to determine off color when you delete that cue. Same modifier but this time cleared of hotcue type - You getting idea? |
| Jonathan Chiuchiolo 15.11.2013 | wouldn't it be better to use the zomo under a shift for griding as you would get encoders that could make it really easy, I was believeing of your concept for this and figure to get all the functionality you require you would need to sacrifice two buttons to give you three of four shifts, but that has the problem of leaving you with only three buttons, but two of them have to increment and decrement values, which isn't ideal as you might get confused. eg. patDicer.jpg |
| Brunilda Kora 15.11.2013 | Cheers Stewe! I'm using an existing .tsi - here's the link: http://javabass.wordpress.com/2012/0...traktor-2-5-3/ I use my Zomo MC-1000 for looping, so the Green Page (2) of the Dicer is where grid control will need to go. Hotcues 2-5 will remain red on the Dicer. Stewe - are you familiar with Bomes Midi Translator? You could set it up so that buttons on the computer keyboard behave like the Dicer buttons: http://www.bome.com/products/miditra...erview/classic I'm sure you already know about it? It would allow you to replicate ANY button based midi controller using just a computer keyboard (as long as you know the midi messages that the controller sends...) I'm sure it would be useful for you... |
| Kellie Myrum 15.11.2013 | Ok Pat, please attach your .tsi in reply and I'll give it a try and create your yellow hotcue. I'll be blind here without a dicer so you'll test result and let me know. Once we got hotcues I'll move on grid control. |
| Brunilda Kora 15.11.2013 | Breakbeat, Drum and Bass, Hip-Hop, Ghetto Funk, Reggae, Funk, Soul, Rock, Ska... I wouldn't trust autogrid. I never trusted autowarp in Ableton, and I want to get into the habit of griding a track once, properly. |
| Johnsie Kingrea 15.11.2013 |
Originally Posted by Patch
|
| Brunilda Kora 15.11.2013 | You definitely Can have different colour LED's on a single page. My DJD mapping had all colours mapped on a single page. And I've seen Traktor mappings (but not for beat griding) that have differnt colour buttons on a single page. The only buttons that cannot have different colours are the page select (smal) buttons. Those are fixed. (1=Red, 2=Green, 3=Amber). Novation_dicer.jpg The big buttons can be any colour that can be made by mixing the 3 different LED's. You can get some pretty cool gradient effect. Dicer Programmers Guide |
| Kellie Myrum 15.11.2013 | Does dicer even share multiple LED color in a single page or each page sets unique color by default? |
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